Forum Replies Created
I understand what you mean.
And i agree, the good condition bonus should either be paid on order of the new car (not on delivery) – or the GCB should take the prolonged wait times (sometimes a year) into account.
I do know that they pay GCB pro rata if you extend your lease. I’d assume that, if you actually have to wait a year, they’d throw in some extra. If not, then they should.
That’s easy to explain. An Evoque is an incredibly cheaply and badly made car, fitted with a good interior. This isn’t “opinion”, you can look at every survey (for example, What Car reliability survey), and the Evoque particularly, and Range Rover generally, score dead last.
There’s nothing in an Evoque that can’t go wrong, starting from (common) gearbox and engine issues, electrical issues, suspension issues, leaking fuel tanks, etc pp. While i agree that it’s a nice place to be inside, i’d rather have 75% of that “niceness” and 500% more reliability.
Our current car (Ateca 1.5 DSG) is objectively the best car i’ve ever had – subjectively though, i “loved” my old E36 325i Coupe more. There’s just not much better (for “mortals” anyway) than a straight six. But that’s many moons ago, i wouldn’t want to miss all the niceties that our car has, that the BMW didn’t have 25 years ago.
It’s surprising considering Peugeot is actually kinda up there in customer satisfaction – they wouldn’t be if their cars were duds.
Now, i don’t know if they build their Vans (i think it was a van?) to the same level/care as their passenger cars.September 23, 2021 at 11:20 am in reply to: £6k Citroen Ami electric city car gets green light for the UK #164774
That could potentially be the ugliest.. well it’s not a car, is it? Ugliest “vehicle” i’ve seen in a long, long time.
Technically, i would argue yes – but there’s the other side (MB) who will argue that the GCB is just an incentive to keep the car nice, not tied to the value (a good condition MB is worth more than a good condition Vauxhall).
I can see it both ways, to be honest. Of course i wouldn’t mind a higher reward for being careful, but i doubt that’s going to happen anytime soon – and if it does, it won’t be much, due to the fact that the used car market will relax eventually as well. The Mondeo you mentioned is 60k miles under the average and rather mint, i’d assume that plays a role.
edit: on top of high spec (not many cars on the scheme have cooled seats).September 22, 2021 at 10:50 am in reply to: How much does granny charging damage the battery life of an EV? #164719
The preserved wisdom from people who actually drive EV’s is that once a month it is good form to charge to 100% as the Battery Management Systems does lots of work in the final 10% from 90-100% charge, managing and balancing out the cells, that final 10% often takes longer than it takes to go from 20-80%.
Yes. That’s, as you mentioned, because EV chargers “balance charge” rather than just charge. Where you’re wrong is the “good to charge to 100% once per month” – there’s literally zero upside to it. It doesn’t do any good. I’ve worked with batteries for almost a decade now, i’m very certain of that. All this “preserved wisdom” is, is the equivalent of “boot her once per drive to clean the catalytic converter”.
It’s not how it works.
You also need to be aware that all batteries have buffers, so when the car shows 0% or 100% state of charge, the battery is actually nearer 5% and 95%, theses buffer zones are unusable to the car, but are there to protect from fully discharging and killing a battery.
That’s partially correct. While true that you have buffer zones (plus overcharge and over-discharge protection, obviously), the voltage remains the same. It’s 3.7V nominal, or 4.2V on full charge – even if it’s only at 95% capacity. And that’s where the problem is.
AC (Slow) charging is believed to be healthier for batteries, but there are plenty of people (me included) who do that vast majority of charging via DC fast chargers, and are seeing no degradation of batteries (Taxis with well over 120k miles all on DC and battery still healthy). Currently I’m getting around 340 miles on a 100% charge.
No, it’s a fact. As in, physical fact. The more you strain the battery, the more it degrades. What’s happening is that, under load (particularly, when hot), the electrolyte in the batteries split (it’s called electrolytic decomposition, and well known. It’s also visible to the naked eye, but because packs are usually not visible in an electric car, that indicator falls away. What’s happening is, that under load and high voltage, the “stuff” in the batteries decomposes, into lithium and oxygen (amongst other stuff, but those two are the important ones) – which leads to two things. A: the batteries visibly grow in size (they “puff” due to the internally released gas), and B: the internal diodes of the battery corrode (that’s the battery degradation, plus of course the loss of carrier-electrolyte).
The biggest thing personally to understand is how you car behaves to charging, and the benefits of different types of charging. I don’t think many new EV owners (Or dealerships) understand how the cars work. Take the Kona for instance, it has a 64kW (Usable) battery, and will charge at 11kw on AC and 77kW on DC, sounds great… But it will only charge at 77kW for a very short time and only at a specific battery state and temperature, if it’s not in the sweet spot, it will be much slower. The same goes for chargers, you are lucky to get much more that 44kW from a 50kW charger.
I actually do agree that dealerships don’t seem to understand how EVs work, but it’s hard to blame them. I’ve worked with various variations of lithium packs in the last decade (Li-Ion, Li-Po, LiFe-Po4), and it’s not like your average AA battery – nothing with them is.
The very fact is, to prolong the life of a battery (any lithium battery), you only charge it to slightly above their nominal voltage (3.7V), and discharge it slightly below. That’s where these batteries are “storage charged” as well (i don’t think EVs have that option, though imho they very much should – but that’s how they’re charged by the factory – to roughly 40% capacity and 3.7V, because that’s where the least degradation happens). Everything above 3.7V is various levels of bad for the battery, getting worse the higher you go. That’s why “charging to 100% (regardless of whether it actually is 100%, or 95%) isn’t good for the battery and should only be done if you need the range.
One should also mention that while i agree that dealerships/salesmen are clueless, those battery warnings don’t come from the car manufacturer, but the battery manufacturer, just relayed.
Lastly: batteries have come a long way in the last decade or two, and the degradation is nowhere near what it was even 5 years ago (if i recall the article correctly, it’s almost slashed in half) – but basic physics and chemistry don’t change. The packs are more resistant, but they still degrade. And they will always degrade for the same reasons, until we get to solid state batteries (not another decade, would be my guess) that don’t require an electrolyte. This is all kinda moot though, since we only have the car for three to five years, even if you blast it, at most you’ll lose around 15% in that timeframe. Which, btw, doesn’t show in the indicator. The indicator doesn’t measure the internal resistance of the battery (which increases due to the poles corroding through released oxygen/lithium), which means that the battery indicator can read 100% (or 3xx miles), but the battery discharges itself completely within 100 miles (extreme example).September 22, 2021 at 9:42 am in reply to: How much does granny charging damage the battery life of an EV? #164713
Smells better too.September 22, 2021 at 8:39 am in reply to: How much does granny charging damage the battery life of an EV? #164707
Generally speaking, charging slowly rather than quick is better for battery health.
That said, i wouldn’t suggest charging while the battery is above, lets argue, 50%. Nor under 20%. Batteries degrade by charging/discharging fast, by being fully charged and by being very low.
If you can (and i understand that at 29 hours for a full charge that might not be possible all the time), i’d plug it in at 30%. If possible, you actually want to avoid charging to 100% as well. There’s no reason to do it (other than if you need maximum range of course). That’s a relic from times where batteries suffered from memory effect (reduced capacity if you didn’t charge them fully) – this isn’t the case with EV batteries.
This is was Kia says (matches what all other manufacturers say, just the first google result).
1. Minimize exposure to extremely high temperatures when parked
Exposure to the extreme heat while parking unplugged is when the frequent danger occurs. An automated temperature control system installed in your electric car will needlessly drain your batteries to keep the temperatures down for optimal efficiency. While this performance should only work when your electric vehicle is on the road using its battery, park your electric car in the shade or plug-in so that its thermal management system functions only using grid power, and make sure a stable range of temperatures during operation either.
2. Minimize the batteries at 100% state of charge
Electric cars already have installed with a battery management system that avoids them being charged and discharged at the extreme state of charge. Keeping the state of battery charge, from 0 percent to 100 percent , also improves the performance of the battery life of your vehicle. Even though a full charge will give you the maximum operating time, it is never a good idea for the overall lifespan of your battery.
3. Avoid using fast charging
If your batteries are soon-to-be die out, using a fast-charging is a great convenience. However, it presses so much current into the batteries in a short period which strains your EV battery and wanes them faster. While it is hard to notice its degradation, eight years of standard charging will give you 10% more battery life compared to 8 years of using fast charging.
4. Control the optimal battery state of charge during long storage
EVs that are parked or stored with an empty or full battery also degrades the battery. If you do not use your electric car often or having a long trip plan, get a timed charger, and plug it in. Leaving your vehicle at 100 percent while parked at a certain place for a long period, the battery will struggle with preserving its state of charge while you are away. One strategy is to set the charger to keep the charge just above the low mark, not filling it up to the maximum capacity, at an average charge level between 25 percent and 75 percent.September 21, 2021 at 11:09 am in reply to: Glos Guy and Other X1 owners – help needed please! #164645
I’ve had loads of diesels and I have to say that I’ve not experienced any of the problems that Rene mentions.
This is basic physics. Unless you drive a magic carpet, this doesn’t change. Petrols are less thermoefficient (generate more heat), weigh less due to not being cast iron everything (less “block” to heat up, lighter pistons etc) and run thinner oil.
All of that means that a diesel takes considerably longer to heat up. That’s the reason why diesel isn’t recommended for short journeys (apart from the DPF issue) – otherwise it wouldn’t make much sense to buy a petrol at all (especially in countries like germany, where diesel is 23p a litre cheaper than petrol). A short journey (<15 minutes) isn’t enough to bring a diesel to temperature (especially in city traffic).
You might not have noticed, sure – but as i said, there’s no way around this, there’s no magic diesels that don’t work like this. Don’t just take my word for it btw, plenty of sources on the web on that.
You are correct though, i missed the weekly motorway journey, DPF wouldn’t be an issue there.
Seen a few steam powered cars on Jay Lenos youtube channel (Doble E-20 etc) – i actually kinda like the idea. Would be rather steampunk nowadays, which is also cool.September 21, 2021 at 6:11 am in reply to: Glos Guy and Other X1 owners – help needed please! #164623
The x-drive is better if you are driving in mud or snow, but going up and down hills the s-drive is fine. All cars have traction control. The dealer should have mentioned diesel engines aren’t good for many short journeys. Unless you do lots of miles, I would get a 2 litre s-drive. Over the three years and 22000 miles we had ours it averaged over 42 mpg which was generally about 38 locally and on long motorway journeys 50mpg was easy to get.
All correct, but one thing to add, because that’s of importance for us in particular: Diesels take considerably longer to get warm. Not just the engine, but the cabin as well. Since my wife has to combat Raynaud’s amongst other things, for us it’s important that the cabin gets warm as quickly as possible. In a petrol (ours), it takes around 200 metres for the heater to spew warmth – it takes considerably longer in a diesel.
Not to mention that with many short trips, DPFs can create issues, though there’s better and worse engines for that. Short trips are never great for oil burners though, and there’s quite literally zero upside to them (higher up front cost, higher running cost, more weight, higher consumption due to the engine not getting warm on shorter trips/inefficiency etc). They are torquier in lower RPMs, but with turbo petrols, that’s negligible. That’s not to say that diesels don’t have their place – but for most non-commuting people, petrols are just the better engine.
Those posters apparently never bought a car in their life then, because paying a deposit on a new car is pretty much standard practice – for a reason.
Also, i’m sorry, there’s no “pressure”. You do your due diligence, test drive cars, and choose one. That deposit is precisely to prevent people from ordering a car and changing their mind two days later. You do realise that there are costs involved for dealerships to get a car ready?
You get the £500 back if there’s a fault on the dealerships side. You’ll have to claw it back if your reason for cancelling an order is “you just found a better one” – which you should’ve ordered then in the first place, meaning you did not do your research.
Seems pretty fair to me.
We did pay £500 deposit on our SEAT too. I don’t see an issue with it, not necessary to get offended and huffy puffy by everything.
As usual, finished car is gonna look like this.
Yeah, we were very surprised by that too.
No, they don’t. The Peugeot 3008 for example does not.
In this particular case, it does though.
Both wall charger and fast charger cable included according to the spec sheet. Mode 2 is the socket charger.
As much as ive ordered a new car, i think it might have to be cancelled if wait times become silly. I expect many will just put motability builds back in favour of retail sales.
If you’re ordering a factory build, you’re waiting as long as we do. Forums for specific cars are full of complaints in regards to waiting times.
Your only choice in that part is to get a vehicle from stock.
The new x1, will be a nice desirable car
Remains to be seen.
Generally, yes. But chances are, us Motability customers only get the 3 pot 136hp engine (if the car comes to the scheme), which appears to be BMWs “base engine” now for all new cars. I don’t know how appealing an SUV with 136hp is – had the same problem with the GLA, albeit that problem kinda solved itself now anyway.
I’m hoping for the ID4 to pull an “ID3” and get its AP slashed by 70%. If they’d offer the (available) top ID4 (i think Family, for a ridiculous £8500 AP) for around £3500-£4000, it’d become a proper contender on the shortlist. As it stands, not so much.
Mercedes didn’t just pull out of Motability, but all fleet operations (SIXT isn’t offering Mercedes’ anymore either, because they don’t get any – internationally). Whether or not it works for them, time will tell. I’m pretty sure that they’ll be just fine.
The question as it stands is, will other premium manufacturers follow suit (BMW, Audi, maybe even VW). I certainly hope not (albeit the offer of BMW isn’t that great for us anyway).
My best guess for additions would probably be the new Peugeot 308 (was already on the scheme at ridiculous prices, would assume they start offering it “properly”). The new Kia Sportage won’t make it in Q4 (will reach showrooms in march 22 according to our dealership). Other than that, i don’t think we’re over the hill just yet in regards to chip shortage – so i don’t think we’ll see the removed models (like Tiguan, Ateca etc) return just yet. But that’s based on my own pessimism (our shortlist leader got removed in the first wave, and with our luck, it won’t return for another year).
I understand this is a german newspaper, but you can google-translate it. In short: Mercedes isn’t just pulling out of Motability. SIXT (car rental) doesn’t get Mercedes’ anymore either. They still offer VW, BMW etc – yet if you want a Mercedes as a rental, there’s only a few “special vehicles” (Vans, basically) left.
So it’s not just that they pulled out of Motability – they reduced their fleet services significantly overall, internationally.
It’s a moot point anyway.
The very fact that you certainly can buy a car from (dwindling) stock is factually proof that disabled people aren’t discriminated against. You can buy a car just like every abled person.
You just have to pay the same price. If you don’t want to, or simply can’t (i know we can’t and have no qualms admitting it), i don’t think it’s too much to ask to wait in line until you get your brand new £35k car.
Discrimination against disabled would be if you couldn’t buy a car privately because you’re disabled. Not getting a car as fast as a private buyer (ignoring all other benefits of Motability that a private customer doesn’t get) isn’t discrimination. In my opinion anyway.
After all, motability is a charity isn’t it..
Volkswagen isn’t, though.
We’re in a year where car manufacturers took up to 50% losses. It’s kinda entitled to argue that they should wave their own wellbeing (selling cars at higher price) to suit yours – which only amounts to “reduced waiting time”. Yes, they “committed” to the scheme – that’s why you can order a VW in the first place.
Dashcams are a bad example considering there’s a “legal” way to mount them and an illegal way.
We have dashcams front and rear, legally mounted. You’ll lose one 12V port in the car, which i’ve never used once in 30 years (tell a lie, i did once, for a tyre compressor – didn’t need dashcam running in that situation then, and it blew a fuse immediately so that’s not happening anymore either), other than that it’s as invisible as a hardwire install with wires tucked under the pillar trim/roofline.
Especially people with off-street parking don’t need “bump alarm start” either, which would be the only upside to hardwiring it.
Fitting a roof box would be considered a modification to the car (which is why it becomes an issue with insurance cover – you’re not allowed to modify the car), hence would at the very least need the A-OK from Motability. Dashcam hardwire installs (as well as paint sealing/ceramic coating etc) have to be done by the dealership. My guess would be, that the same goes for the roofbox. I’d phone up Motability to be certain – i don’t technically see a problem with buying a roofbox (got decent experiences with Thule) and having Peugeot mount it, shouldn’t be a big job.
That said.. 520l of boot space. That should cover you for quite a bit. Not sure how many people you’re travelling with, but if it’s three (you, husband, son), you can also flip one of the seats and gain 100l or so.
If we’re talking about “not the whole story”, you might wanna point out that a Motability sale nets the dealership less than 10% of a normal sale, regardless of targets. On average a dealership makes around 5%-7% per new car sale, which amounts to £1000-£1500 per new car sale to a private buyer.
20 Motability cars in a dealership might make them meet their targets and receive the full bonus of £10000-£20000 (depending on the dealership) – but you left out the fact that on those 20 cars they only earned £2000 through sales, rather than £20000.
Your argument of “that lowly sale could tip the scale” only becomes important at the very end of the month/quarter/year. It certainly can become important (when you know there’s only a few cars missing to meet the target) – but until that point, it’s not.
230 pounds on top of a weekly wage is good, no? Try to get 2 deals a week and that is very good imo.
That’s not how it works.
It’s £230 in total. The salesman will make £45 to £50. The dealership gets £100 for giving the car to you, £75 for taking your old one back, and £40 for the first service in addition to the servicing costs.
This is from a member (Trev).
Again. Compared to what they make on a private sale, it’s barely anything.