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Chemtrails turning the frogs gay!
Did you know, the moon landing never happened. It’s faked. The plate you can personally ping with your laser? Has always been there, it’s just a natural mirror that happened to line up perfectly, potentially left there by the reptilians. It was directed by Stanley Kubrick at the far edge of the disc we live on, roughly 100 miles from the eternal ice ring around our planetary disc that nobody is allowed to come close to.
.. sometimes the lack of, lets say, facilities is disturbing. Ignoring the incredible illegality of an installed tracker without consent, what would be the point in the first place?
Quite obviously this is utter drivel by someone who just wants to feel important for a minute. Anyone with even a little bit of critical thinking left will immediately notice that this would not be compatible in any way, shape or form with any data protection law including the UK GDPR.
It’s not unlikely, it’s completely, 100% impossible. And, much like with the “fake moon landing”, imagine how many people need to know about this who never said a single thing. Be it MB whistleblowers, or any technician ever working on a new MB car.
Unless of course these trackers are fitted by men in suits and sunglasses, at night, sneaking into a dealership to compare VINs to find the MB customer vehicles and wire a tracking device that is so advanced, that no technician ever finds it. Maybe they even have weird metallic lollipops that flash a light, so the mechanics just forget what they saw, since one of these “Men in Black” sits at every dealership across the UK making sure that the trackers are fitted.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.https://businessquarter.co.uk/motability-changes-face-formal-legal-challenge/
That went in another direction than i thought when looking at Joes link, so that’s my bad.
That said, while i could see restricted access to “premium brands” etc may be legally dubious, mileage allowance, VAT etc are not.
I wish them the best (though looking at current prices, a base model 3 series at 5 digits AP would absolutely change everything for the better), but nah.. I can’t see anything change for the better from this. Sure, give us the premium brands back – or don’t, that’s also cool.
The one thing i’d wish for is that MB staff carries their part of the burden, too. I would never wish anything bad upon anyone working at MB, but instead of permanently and almost reflexively reaching into the pockets of the disabled people rather than start working at making the entire company more efficient through streamlining.. It’s kind of hard to swallow paying 25p for a mile extra when i look at the pay package/benefits etc a MB employee gets. As awful as that may sound, there’s no “them and us” – if we go, they go. So the burden should, in my opinion, be shared too.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Nah, you’re completely right Wardy. It’s nonsense, much like the argument that was made that a mandatory black box for under 30s is discriminatory and hence, illegal.
Don’t know where these kinda views come from, but reality isn’t it. I think it may have to do with people thinking that MB is purely a charity, hence not “a commercial entity”, which is.. well, kinda correct, but wrong.
The best way to describe MB as entity (meaning, both Motabilities) would be “a charity subsidised by an commercial subsidiary”. Well. The most accurate, probably not the best. Point being, people think that MB is a charity and that if they make cuts/adjustments, it amounts to discrimination.
I assume that is in regards to the black box (i may be entirely off, since nothing anywhere even tries to explain what the potential pursued legal action is supposed to be). Which makes this a non-starter, since even the cited Equality Act 2010 clearly allows for insurers etc to use age to make assessments (and act on it) in regards to risks.
There also is no discrimination if it becomes standard for all new leases, while not being mandatory for existing accounts (if it stays like that). The difference here is simply that while it is a “two tier system”, it’s not based on disability but customer/account status (new vs existing).
That all said.. Yeah, that link stinks. It’s safe, of course, as all google docs (docs.google.com) are since they already run sandboxed and have absolutely zero way to interact with your PC, but i certainly wouldn’t put any details into a form that looks a little like it’s designed to fish for disabled peoples email-addresses. At least, for now, without a bit more detail on what they’re actually trying to do (and who they are in the first place, that’d help too).
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Would take me two weeks to lose the lease probably, due to a grey haired army (and self-conceited wankers, usually in Deranged Rovers) having the tendency to apparently not see a 5m yacht coming in a roundabout, feeling the urge to end themselves right there and then. With frightening regularity.
I can genuinely say that there isn’t a day going by where someone isn’t pulling out right in front of me in a roundabout, despite indicating and driving a huge white whale.
The only thing i could do even more to prevent this is driving into a roundabout with the horn taped down, and i bet even then someone just doesn’t care.
And yes. Braking harshly to prevent a crash is marked down in the app, since it does in no way, shape or form take other peoples driving into account. Takeaway being, if you’re in the red for a week it may actually be smarter to just crash the car rather than get marked down for a consecutive week, since in that case you can prove that you weren’t at fault – whereas an emergency brake in case of being cut off is actually pretty hard to prove.
There already is a way to check whether or not i drive erratically. It’s called No Claims Bonus and points on the license. I have never made a claim, i have never received a speeding nor parking, nor any other kind of ticket. I have never had any kind of points either. Cars we’ve given back usually are “as new” condition, including a paint correction (though i’m getting too old for that nowadays). No marks on the car, no visible scratches, never a dent, never a curb-rashed wheel, nothing. No need for a box to create an issue where there never has been one. That simple.
That’s the one step we’ll not accept. Lease prices suck but whatever, mileage reduction sucks but we’ll deal with it – black box? Jog on. Forced us to do the math, turning out the fact that we can get the same car in the higher horsepower version including insurance, tyres and maintenance for less than what we’re paying now, so.. Hey ho.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.It’s a bit of a non-sequitur anyway.
The issue isn’t data collection itself (regardless of how much that matters to individuals), it’s that one WILL lead to you losing your car, and the other doesn’t.
There is no argument to be had on that front. While Teslas are data-hogs, more so than others, most of it is anonymised, and you can opt out of a lot of it. But even if you couldn’t, it won’t mark your driving down based on absolute asinine reasons, requiring you to constantly call MB and correct the errors.
One just needs to read through the experiences with the app to see how many false flags it throws.
In the end, most of what the Tesla can collect of me that’d be of any kind of importance to me is already collected by google anyway. While i’m not happy about it, it doesn’t affect my day to day life at all, so.. whatever. Certainly do not have the will nor capacity to constantly check what is collecting what and adjust my life and purchases around it. You’ll not get around it anyway. If it’s not your Tesla tracking your driving, it’s your Phone tracking your locations and behaviour – if it’s not your phone, it’s your energy provider tracking when you’re at home/likely to use more electricity, etc pp.
It is what it is.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Even for people who like to change cars somewhat regularly, or want a new car every three years.. Private leasing in many cases already works out cheaper than MB leases.
Just had ChatGPT compare a Tesla Model 3 RWD Long Range, at national average leasing price, with national average insurance cost, against a MB vehicle at £2500 AP (which, lets be real, is nowadays actually on the lower end).
It works out £2000 cheaper than the Motability lease. Yes, Motability does include tyres and maintenance, but an EV doesn’t actually need maintenance in the first three years other than tyres (£150 a tyre if you want Michelin or Pirelli, £70 a tyre if ching long is good enough). So lets assume 6 premium tyres (because that’s what you get with MB), then you’re at £900 at most. Still £1100 saved.
Yeah, it’s still a Tesla (Tossler), but genuinely, at that price, including Supercharger access at reduced rates, even i could be convinced to drive one, despite how much i dislike the car itself (be it the door handles, the “gear lever” on the touch screen etc).
And while i haven’t checked, if you can get a decent EV for that kind of money, decent ICE vehicles should be very possible too.
In fact, for funsies, i had it run an actual comparison, the Golf 1.5 204 eTSI Match on the scheme is £7000 AP (!!!). That, in 3 years, adds up to £19.500. A private lease including insurance, same timeframe, adds up to £13.6k–£14.3k. If you require £5k worth of tyres and maintenance in three years, i don’t know what to tell you. This is real prices as to what we would pay (my insurance quote, i mean).
Motability should be ashamed to even offer these kinds of “deals” under the “all inclusive cheap motoring” umbrella. This is before they add VAT, and not even considering the fact that a new driver would even have to install spyware in the car and on his phone.
Even on 0 AP vehicles, like the Dacia Jogger 1.0, we’d get away cheaper leasing and insuring it privately (would add up to £10.444 excluding tyres over three years, as opposed to the £13k MB takes).
The one, single advantage that MB has is that you don’t need good credit. Which makes them, in my view, predatory. I’d assume quite a few people don’t have the choice to lease privately (or finance a used car etc) due to their credit score. MB is seriously starting to look like they’re exploiting the desperation of a large part of the disabled community by charging them MORE (despite getting the car cheaper) than they’d pay privately.
Yes, yes. Convenience. Not sure how convenient weekly calls to MB are trying to explain as to why you got a red score by the App for driving the wrong way around through a one way street that it falsely identified as such (happens en masse).
We probably have one of the last decent deals through the scheme, if nothing changes in the future (quite monumentally, too) then this is also our last car through the scheme. And i’d suggest to everyone who is able to, to at least browse the private market for an hour or two to just get an idea as to how expensive the scheme really has become.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Yeah, i believe it when i see it.
As it stands, i very much doubt that we’ll see a fully equipped, 750hp (yes, 750hp, 553kw, 0-60 in 3.2 seconds) EV on the scheme for £2995 at a time when the scheme has to start penny pinching.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.I entirely agree with Glos Guy. For once.
I wouldn’t even go as far as Glos would – i’d simply ask MB to offer an additional package. This doesn’t even need to be done at the dealership level, that can just be done entirely through the webpage where you can access your lease information.
Go there, press “buy this package”, transfer £1100 to MB, and within however many weeks it takes, they revert the insurance back to the 20k miles per annum limit, plus an additional set of tyres or whatever.
This isn’t hard to do or track.
That all said.. They do mention that there will be solutions for exceptional issues. I’d assume that if you’re in work and can prove that you NEED to drive 15k miles per annum, they’ll be able to accommodate that one way or another.
Customers take out a contract knowing they only have 30k miles and need to budget accordingly for any extra. Or realise the scheme no longer meets their needs and look elsewhere. Even if that means an older or cheaper form of transport via other means.
This is the one point where i agree with Mike as well. While i do think, as mentioned, that there should be the choice to pay extra upfront for “the old mileage allowance”, if they’re hell bent to not do that, then yeah, 30k miles is 30k miles.
This isn’t a weird concept either, if you’re at the pump and get fuel for 150 miles, you don’t go on a 400 mile journey. If you only have 30k miles to play with, then you don’t look at the mile-o-meter and gasp at the accidental 35k you did in 18 months.
He’s inarguably correct there: it’s not a surprise cost. You know the deal.
My argument would be, that there should be an option to change the deal, beneficial to both parties.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Similar boat for me.
Got the I6 for quite some time to come now, we’ll enjoy it – if it turns out that our next lease would get one of them stupid boxes, go ahead. If you deem my driving not satisfactory despite giving cars back in better condition than i get them (paint corrected, not a single mark or dent), having never gotten a single point, ticket or had an accident, then it very much is your loss, not mine.
Yeah, we’ll likely spend more on a private lease – mainly because there is a considerably tastier choice available, but i mean.. It is what it is. We’re not married to Motability, if they’d rather make a £15k loss on a brand new car due to instant depreciation than keeping us as a customer, then that’s their right.
Seen some cracking leasing deals on the new Ioniq 6 N.. wouldn’t mind. Or, heck, our current car (as dual motor variant), can be had for like £24k with <30k miles. I could see myself owning this boat happily.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.The actually make a ridiculously small amount of money for each order, I’ve been told as little as £50 per vehicle! That doesn’t even cover the cost of a couple of hours with the Motability specialist.
Bit of a non-sequitur. The vast majority of salesmen don’t care for the dealership numbers, why would they. A McDonalds burgerflipper isn’t interested in the target sales either, that’s a management issue, not for the guy who tries to sell you a car.
Before it’s brought up, the vast majority of salesmen in the UK just get paid an hourly rate. There’s no performance based rates (anymore). We talked about this with our current contact at Hyundai, when we originally ordered the car we were talking about why we didn’t immediately mention that we’re MB customers.
His reply was that it doesn’t matter at all. He gets a car out of the door, doesn’t matter who it goes to – it makes no impact on his salary. Of course, the branch manager may have a different idea (because for him, there is a difference between a MB and private customer, money wise) – but the average salesguy has no stakes.
We had one bad experience (and i went through quite a few dealerships for SEAT, Ford, VW, Skoda, Renault, Hyundai etc), with a VW dealership in Bridgend. We opted to bite the bullet and drove 40ish miles to the next one, where we then met a lovely lady (Denise in Port Talbot), who was as friendly as could be, made us feel welcome and even rolled out the red carpet when we picked up the car (complete with red bow on the bonnet etc in the “special pick up hall”).
Point being: if you’re getting awful service, it generally has more to do with the fact that you met a prick. Be it political views (“hurr free cars”), being a general muppet or simply a bad day, from our experience, there’s no systemic discrimination against a MB customer. Been with the scheme for 10 years now, and to roughly 15 dealerships of all kinds of marques (even a Mercedes one, we were looking at the GLA a long time ago) including countless test drives – and apart from that one guy at VW Bridgend (which, as we’ve been told in Port Talbot, isn’t popular with other employees either), we haven’t had a single bad experience.
Quite the opposite, indeed. We almost always got an in-situ test drive, usually for 60 minutes and unaccompanied, coffee etc. We had extended test drives (Golf GTE, 5 hours), we had offers for 24 and 48 hour test drives (Ford Explorer) without asking, in that case from the sales manager directly etc – at least here in south wales, there’s no noticeable difference. I don’t know how the vast majority of dealerships could’ve made us feel more welcome.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.3. I do over 25,000 miles a year: they cannot prohibit you from driving above their annual limit of 20,000, but yes you will pay the extra. Which are peanuts in comparison to other options.
For now. Depending on when his new contract starts, he may have vastly different terms since that’s one of the things MB looks into changing to keep the lights on (mileage to 10k, 28p per mile over etc).
Since that’s one of the more sensible changes (the majority of people in scheme cars barely drives 5000 miles per annum).. I’d keep an eye on that.@Rene I did some in depth looking on Kia forums when mitch started looking at the EV4, haven’t come across issues with the iccu on EV4 on the forums or later EV3’s for that matter after software updates were released, however they sit on 400v.
Worth keeping in mind that EV3 and EV4 are brand new. Given the fact that there are very much already reports of ICCU failures in the EV3 my statement/suggestion is correct. EV3 and 4both on the same modified E-GMP platform, the ICCU in EV3 and EV4 is the same.
The ICCU does have a different hardware identifier in EV3/4 than in Ioniq 5/6, but quite clearly that issue isn’t resolved yet.
Though i’m not quite sure what you mean by “later” EV3, there hasn’t been a recall or change in hardware as far as i can tell. There have been software fixes, but there have been software fixes/recalls for Ioniqs too and none of them worked. The ICCU update for EV3 was in June, i have seen threads just now from July and August (though i can’t tell whether or not they had the OTA).
No one even knows why they fail, really – one of the suspected culprits is heat, wouldn’t 400v as opposed to 800v make that problem worse, since you (correct me if i’m wrong, i know you know more than me in that regard) you need to carry more current?
In the end, i said my piece, if it’s resolved – all good. I doubt it is, and if i was more invested i’d check deeper through reddit and forums as well to maybe get a clearer picture whether or not the ICCU update was the fix. The underlying hardware issue is still not sorted though, considering there certainly are plenty of EV3 ICCU failures prior to June.
Ultimately though, the Enyaq simply is a lot more car for not that much more money. If the choice is between an HMG car with “potentially software-fixed ICCU” and an Enyaq which doesn’t have that issue in the first place, that’s a simple one. Albeit, MickCs suggestion does make more sense, both financially and for potential future options.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.My mum has a Kona electric @Rene mentioned, but the base model AP is equivulent to the Enyak so I omitted it based on the Enyak being superior, along with being a decent size familiy car (also being larger than the other 2 mentioned)
Indeed. Unless you can get a deal from your Hyundai dealer, for the money, the Enyaq is the best offering in my opinion, with the EV4 (despite being cheaper) being a close second.
Part of that is that i kind of find the EV4 weird looking, whereas the Enyaq in my opinion is one of the best looking EVs out there still. It’s not an efficiency blob. But that, of course, is subjective. The (still ongoing) ICCU issues with Hyundai Motor Group cars (Hyundai, Kia and Genesis) is the more important reason though.
As MickC stated, extension is also an option if the main issue on the current car is the missing two seats. If you can’t have those two seats, might as well stick with the car you currently have and wait out a few new quarterly lists. You never know, might get lucky and the Peaq gets added with a decent AP.
APs for “higher end” cars are hard to judge, you get a Vauxhall PHEV for £7000 on one hand, and the Ioniq 6 top spec for as low as £500 when we ordered.
Or, it could always be that the e-5008 comes down in price. Now, with all the new MB “issues” (VAT, PayperMile etc) coming soon, that probably is wishful thinking, but.. you know. One can cling to hope.
edit: one other rather long shot, you can always hunt for deals. In the pinned “Deals” thread recently, a dealership in York offered £800 off all Peugeots. You may of course have to travel to where the discount is offered, but in almost all cases, the savings outweigh the outlay for travel by magnitudes.
£800 still probably leaves the E-5008 out of reach, but, you know. Browse and see if something works out (i only checked two of the 9 pages).
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.I disagree with @Rene on Hybrids, whils’t mild hybrids are marketing ploy, full hybrids certainly have a place and PHEV’s are ideal if you don’t exceed their battery range otherwise the economy plummets.
Not really disagreeing, if you just repeat two of the three points i already made verbatim.
Full hybrids don’t justify their increase in price. Show me one that does. To take your car as an example, the FHEV is over £3000 more expensive than the MHEV. For a saving of a litre every 62 miles. 10 litres every 620 miles. 100 litres every 6200 miles, or 1000 litres over 62000 miles. Over 62k miles, you’re half way through making up the £3000 outlay.
Feel free to point out where i’m missing the obvious. Those numbers are already the “pretty” numbers stated by Hyundai themselves, as a sidenote.
As for affordable EVs with decent range, i’m with kezo on the Enyaq and EV4. I’d add the Kona, but genuinely out of all these cars, the Enyaq or EV4 are the ones to go for. Imo the two only really decent EVs currently on the scheme (price-wise).
Personally, despite being a bit steeper, i’d take the Enyaq. Mainly for the raised seats compared to the EV4, but driving a Hyundai, Kia/Hyundai EVs do have a kind of sword of damocles over their head. It’s constantly on our mind that our ICCU could give out any day, randomly, as both Kias and Hyundais are well known for.
The ICCU being the rough equivalent to an alternator. In fact, my brother in law recently (8ish weeks ago) got stuck on a Tesco parking lot because the ICCU gave out in his Kia Niro. Parked, went shopping, got back out and the car was dead. Proper dead, nothing electric worked. The ICCU roughly being the electric equivalent to an alternator, it is uses the driving battery to charge the 12v battery. If that fails, the 12v goes dead, and if the 12v is dead, nothing works. No ignition, no door openers, no key fob, boot etc. In fact, his car didn’t even release the charging cable (he was plugged in at the time), and we had to faff at 0 degrees outside in the rain under the bonnet trying to find the emergency release for the charging plug.
Now. Not all Kias or Hyundais have that issue. But just have a google (Ioniq ICCU, or EV4 etc ICCU) and look for yourself how many do – it’s a bit of a coinflip.
Test drive both and see, i personally wouldn’t look at any other EV on the scheme currently, at those prices.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.We did look at the Citroën Berlingo and Peugeot Rifter, but their range is too short for what we need.
To quickly answer the question in regards to hybrid versus electric, money wise.. Don’t even compare it.
Hybrids are nonsense, the only hybrid system that makes sense in certain use cases is PHEV (if you can charge at home, and stay within or close to the electric range for the majority of drives). MHEV and FHEV are marketing nonsense, the economy of those cars usually is marginally(!) better than a pure petrol engine, but nowhere near enough to amortise itself over 3 years (even ignoring the EV tariff you’d lose).
You could ask for an extension and pray to whoever you’d like for the next few months that the Skoda Peaq comes to the scheme (somewhat doubtful, but you never know – MB seems to get decent deals with Skoda, usually).
Further, as others pointed out, you actually have to be careful since you’re quite considerably over the allowed annual mileage.
One other thing i noticed:
Yes, we looked into it. There’s no space on the school bus for my daughter, and for my son it would cost £10 a day.
If the son is the kid that goes to the school 60 miles away, this offer is actually cheaper than driving him with anything ICE related. On an assumed 130 miles (to be safe), at 50mpg (which you’ll never get in a loaded 7 seater 5008, more like 35mpg but for arguments sake), you use 2.6 gallons of fuel. That’s as near as it makes no difference 12 litres of petrol. No idea how much petrol is in your region, but it sure as hell will go up now with the Iran situation, so lets say £1.50 – £18 for 130 miles (and likely quite a bit more, since 50mpg is very unrealistic for a large petrol SUV – at 35mpg you’re at 18 litres for 130 miles). A tenner per day would actually be an almost 50% saving.
At that mileage it’d almost be worth doing math for diesels, in all honesty. After you clear that up (the mileage thing) with Motability, because that might end up costing you a LOT of money.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.@kezo just checked and car is charging at 7kw and car % limit is set to 80% so hopefully car will stop charging at that point all within the cheap charging tariff which ends at 5am. All done with charger offline and Ohme app offline. I will phone Motability and let them know about Ohme’s phaffing in morning.
Depending on the car, you should be able to set a time schedule in the infotainment, just set it from 11:30 to 5am (or whatever your times are), works a treat. Easier than guessing, and charge limits should still work as well.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Not all sleek hidden door handles are dangerous electrically operated. Hyundai’s Ioniq 5 are mechanical opening. True higher specs electronically pop out, but the final opening is entirely mechanical. You can feel the linkage engaging when opening.
The main issue, the one that led to multiple deaths (including that recent Nio crash), isn’t that the door didn’t unlock due to electric locks or something.
It’s, like for the Tesla Cybergarbage, the fact that the door handles aren’t accessible. Doesn’t matter whether or not they mechanically operate a lock – the issue is/was that the door handles are recessed in a way that makes them inaccessible if the power goes out. Same for the Nio.
So, in a crash, you simply couldn’t even get to the door handle. Again, as has happened in a relatively recent Cybertruck crash, with three teenagers perished despite first responders reaching the car basically immediately (friends were driving behind). They asphyxiated (while unconscious from the crash), while the first responders weren’t able to open the doors, and also had trouble getting through the double glazed windows (they managed eventually, with a tree branch, iirc).
Add to that the absolute asinine placement for emergency releases (front passengers often use it accidentally and break the frameless window because they don’t retract when the emergency release is pulled, the rear passenger release is somewhere hidden under some random arse rubber mat somewhere, though not of consequence in this crash since the victims of the Tesla were unconscious anyway).. Yeah.
PS: flush handles very much are for efficiency reasons. You’d be surprised by the impact. That’s also the reason for this incredibly stupid electric side mirror/camera garbage.
It also very much isn’t a new trend, no idea where you got that idea from. Flush door handles exist in mass produced cars since the 70s. For a really good example, check the early 80s Subaru XT Coupe.
Pretty sure what you mean is retracting door handles, and it really isn’t a trend. It’s Teslas and chinese manufacturers, no one else jumped on that bandwagon.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.I used so little of the normal brakes that in the GTE the rear brake discs had to be replaced at around 9000 miles due to rust and pitting (because the GTE does not have auto brake-cleaning, and i rarely ever used the pads).
But yeah, Kezo is of course correct. As soon as you slow down, basically, the lights come on.
To put the 1.3² into a more palatable frame: if you drive 30mph (around 13.4m/s) and slow down at 1.3², you come to a stop after 10.3 seconds (or around 70m). That’s equivalent to very light to light brake pedal pressure in an ICE car (engine braking into lower gear is around 0.5²).
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.I’m going to say it’s the Bridgestone 20″ tyres, I had them on my previous Ateca and they were worse than useless on that, so bad I never went out in any amount of snow with it.
The GTE came on Bridgestones (18″ though) – and can confirm, absolutely worthless tyre. Ignoring the fact that grip was awful, and braking performance sub-par – they only lasted for 3500 miles, too.
KF fitted Sport Contact 7 on the first change (again: after 3500 miles) in the front, day and night.
That all being said: you’re driving a torque monster in icy conditions. It’s kind of a no-brainer that you have to be more careful with the pedals than with a 150hp front scratcher.
72 Dudes is almost universally correct with his statement, 99% of people who argue that they need AWD, really don’t. Contrary to what some people here believe, they don’t make the car safer to drive in the wet, better in corners, or accelerate better (this one is largely due to us not reaching power-levels where an AWD would matter). The one thing they do do, is reduce range for no objective reason.
I’ll be having my first icy drive in a minute, to the in-laws, curious to see how Pirelli P-Zero handle this (the E-variant) on an RWD. Considering that i already had it “dance” in a wet roundabout recently, at what i (apparently mistakenly) considered a not excessive amount of throttle.. It’ll be entertaining. We do live at the bottom of a hill too.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Buy some Bosch, expensive but they last a lot longer and work a lot better. A284H Bosch Rear Wiper 11″ 280mm AP16U Bosch Aerotwin Multi-Clip 16″ 400mm AP28U Bosch Aerotwin Multi-Clip 28″ 700mm Not used them but indscreenwipersdirect.co.uk get good reviews on the Skoda Elroq & Enyaq UK FB group or Amazon of course.
This is the correct answer imo. I have yet to own a car which doesn’t have crap factory wipers, it’s the first purchase every car gets.
Aerotwins are so much better than factory wipers, it’s not even funny. Not only do they last longer, they’re also quieter. Had them on all cars for over more than a decade now.
As for repairs in general, the only reference i have is normal unscheduled repairs (Brake disc and steering rack on the Golf, USB port on the I6), all of which were authorised within minutes.
But, i assume like Phaedra, if the choice is between sub-par factory wipers for free or much higher quality wipers for my own (somewhat modest amount, wouldn’t spend hundreds of course) money, i’ll go with that. Saves me a lot of time and hassle, plus a superior product.
In fact, the ones Phaedra mentioned there are the same ones we had on the Golf funny enough. Definitely worth the money, vast improvement over the factory ones (which i assume were the same between Enyaq and Golf then as well).
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.How much you can give on that Daily Fail article is shown in the last paragraph.
“With Labour’s ban due to take effect in five years’ time, the new figures will be a worry for ministers as they grapple with a declining interest in hybrid vehicles.”
The Daily Wail seems to have missed the fact that the ZEV Mandate (or “petrol ban”) was a conservative policy. Labour didn’t introduce it, Tories did. Irregardless of what you think of the ban itself, the fact that they just blatantly lie should immediately make you question anything you read in the article. And yes, this isn’t a mistake, it’s a deliberate lie. Boris Johnson was very open about it, i actually still remember his speech about his 10 point plan and the “green industrial revolution” – and it’s not my job to remember this, and i follow politics only tangentially on top.
That said, lets look at the actual claim.
“Death rates in hybrids are higher than in petrol cars”. Okay. So lets start with the obvious issue that this statistic doesn’t actually point out a reason for the fatalities. It’s the typical “9 out of 10 murderers consumed milk for breakfast, ban milk” statement. For all you know, this is coincidence, or may be related to PHEVs generally being considerably more powerful than their non-electrified counterparts.
Without knowing the cause of the fatalities (as in, battery fires etc), you actually can’t infer anything from that statistic in regards to their safety.
Hybrids also aren’t more prone to fire. Think about it for a second, in a vacuum. You have battery vehicles (be it PH or BEV) on one side, and then on the other, you have a thin metal/plastic container full of liquid that is literally designed to catch fire/explode.
If the battery itself was an issue, BEVs would be prone to fire. They’re not – they’re far less likely to burn compared to an ICE vehicle. Leaves the claim that batteries in PHEVs somehow magically degrade because, in the DMs mind, it’s mounted on top of the exhaust manifold. Which of course it isn’t. It usually is mounted in the floor or boot. They don’t get hot. This is, yet again, shown by the fact that batteries in BEVs have to be actively cooled (or reduced in power output), whereas in Hybrids, that is not the case – because they don’t get hot enough. This entire claim is nonsense.
Now, the reason we’re arguing “fire” here after arguing “deaths involving hybrids” is a claim made by US outlets, lets look at that then.
For starters, this isn’t a statistic. It’s a third party aggregate estimate – there are actually no official numbers corroborating this.Those US numbers are based on “dozens” of reviews, as well as some cobbled together numbers from non-official sources.
For us here, the numbers published by swedens MSB (Civil Contingencies Agency) are considerably more applicable (similar regulations), as well as more reliable. They’re somewhat less precise since they bunch up PHEVs with BEVs, but it’s still an absolutely obvious picture. In Sweden, 0.004% of all electric vehicles (as mentioned: PHEVs and EVs) caught fire. For ICE, that number is 0.08%.
And that sounds about right. I can’t tell you why the australian interpretation of cobbled together US data is so far off, but every statistic apart from this one points the entirely opposite direction, leading to a “vaccines cause autism” situation yet again, where one outlet (or “doctor”) releases an outlandish and moronic claim, and the media just runs away with it for decades to come.
That all said: if “errmahgurrd fire” is the problem, the solution is very simple. Ban petrol and diesels – will save plenty of multi-story car parks as well, considering they exclusively get set on fire by ICE vehicles so far.
Worth pointing out that the Mail did not reference the swedish numbers, despite them clearly popping up in a google search when you look for statistics on hybrid fires. You’ll also find statements by Thatcham Research, pointing out that ICE vehicles are much more likely to be subject to a fire related insurance claims than EV and PHEV.
0.001% for EVs, 0.003% for PHEV and REX (something like a QQai E-Power), 0.07% for Petrol and 0.011% for Diesel.
Lining up quite nicely with the swedish numbers.
Long story short.. Sensationalist nonsense, deliberately designed to mislead readers. In terms of fire safety, hybrids are no more dangerous than a container filled with explosive liquid driving 50mph, and IF they are more likely to kill someone (which i don’t think based on the statistic), it’s likely due to being on average 25-50% more powerful than the equivalent petrol engine (a Golf has 150hp, the smallest Golf PHEV has 204, goes up to almost 270 in the GTE). The battery clearly isn’t “the killer”, nor is the additional weight (BEVs have more of both battery and weight).
PHEVs are not less safe than ICE vehicles. You can get into more trouble due to being more powerful, but that’s a fault in the driver, not the propulsion system.
I didn’t even want to post this, but for people like Oscarmax’ wife, i think it’s important to point out, including a few hard and official numbers.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.What is far right in people wanting transparency? Too many people get benefits just for claiming they cannot work due their mental state. But they have enough mental state to go on the TV? The whole system must be reshuffled. If Liebour wanted, they could get out and provide a clear and concise message that Motability scheme offering very expensive car with unlimited AP would be better for the treasury’s coffin. But they’re spineless, led by pro-palestine, pro-trans pro-whatever-you-want but the needs of the majority of the British people.
He doth protest too much.
Way to address absolutely nothing of what has been said and argue millions of miles past the actual topic.
Here’s a hint. This isn’t about immigrants, nor jews, nor, in fact, eligibility. This is about “free luxury cars”, as peddled by and to ignorant morons. You know, the people complaining that disabled people drive BMWs. Disabilities of any kind.
PS: no one mentioned “far right”. I said ignorant right-wingers, but the shoe quite clearly fits.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.How can Reeves be “backing British manufacturers on the scheme” when it’s the impractical MINI hatch, Nissan Juke and Qashqai, the Toyota Corolla and the Stellantis van based MPVs?
I don’t think that’s meant as a matter of fact statement.
I’m not happy about it, i do think choice is important and i don’t see why a disabled person shouldn’t be able to order a BMW if he/she so desires (despite the horrendous prices).
That being said… It could be way worse. This way she can claim that the scheme is now “more fit for purpose”, and fend of the bollocks nonsense spouted by the toilet-papers and other usual right-wing suspects. The “more domestic car stuff” is just hot air.
Particularly of note is that there still are plenty of “luxury cars” on the scheme. They didn’t remove “luxury cars” (despite the claim made), they removed a few luxury brands. Cars like the Ioniq 6, Volvo V60 etc are still available. If you want to spend stupid/BMW money, you can also still opt for Polestars.
All in all.. I don’t feel like the scheme functionally has been impacted at all. If that allows her to push back against Badenoch, Farage and all the other ignorant folks, then that’s plenty okay. In my opinion anyway.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Does actually seem reasonably correct to me depending on where he lives. I don’t know where he lives, you seem to do since you disregard that factor entirely – but for someone who doesn’t know where he lives, this price difference wouldn’t necessarily be a surprise.
To take your particular example, the M50i on average is around £1000 in New Quay (TR8), and £4900 in London (E10). Same car, same circumstances. Just by being in the “wrong” area.
Just location and age together can more than tenfold the premiums (a roughly 30% increase in insurance for 30-40 year olds to 50+).
For funsies, i ran the insurance gauntlet with a close approximation (2018 Insignia Elite Nav, 2l diesel, £6k) and a mix of his and my information (don’t know his age, so took mine, my approximate address etc), with a mix of “good” and “bad” choices for the multiple choice stuff.
Came out to £603 (£250 voluntary excess) cheapest. I live rural in bumfork nowhere, so £750 is rather realistic.
As for the “automatic only” marker, ran the exact same details twice (with the license changed to “auto only”), exact same quotes.
email of course a temp one.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Didn’t have any issues with our Ohme + Bluelink app (Ioniq 6) – but i haven’t tried the Hyundai app, refuse to use it due to bugs (showing range in km etc).
That said: while you wait for them to get back to you, you can still charge the car. In the Ohme app, set a schedule to charge only from 11:30pm to 5:30am, departure time like 10am next day (you have to set a departure time).
It will not take advantage of the “intelligent” part of Intelligent Go, but you still get discounted charging. Just slightly less convenient. Allows you to use the car proper at least.
edit: though, if the VW app is anything to go by, server issues are common – may be some issue Hyundai-side.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.Isn’t it interesting how many of us went down the PHEV route and haven’t been impressed?
Not really.
It just shows who couldn’t be bothered to read into it, which is on them. And somewhat proven here as well, with people not even knowing how much of the total propulsion is provided by the electric motor.
You really can’t complain or “not be impressed” with the power of the electric motor when you didn’t know how much power it has in the first place – before you order the car, preferably.
PHEVs have an admittedly narrower use case than other cars, that said..
The fact that people are insistent that something is bad, rather than accepting that their expectations are simply unrealistic or stupid is beyond funny nowadays. In this thread alone you have people complaining that the car in its most economical setting “doesn’t make 300bhp”, didn’t know how much power it has in the first place, are “bothered” by plugging the car in (a process that literally takes less than 15 seconds) etc.
It’s the same kind of people who buy a 330d, drive it 2 miles up town and back and wonder why they’re only averaging 17mpg, and the heater doesn’t work. Yeah, if you don’t use the car as intended, then who’d have thought, it’s not going to work out great. We didn’t get a diesel because it’d be moronic to do so in our use case – i cannot fathom why this is such a foreign concept to the vast majority of people here. Neither can i fathom how someone with our requirements looks at a diesel and goes “yeah, lets get this, makes sense”.
No, PHEVs aren’t bad. You bought the wrong car, because you didn’t “do your research” before/think it through.
PHEVs very much work for many people, over a total of 34 months of “ownership” we drove the GTE 16k miles, with a fuel bill (total) of around £870 – and that’s exclusively “Momentum” (and EV tariff).
This is the same nonsense as people who can’t charge at home, were warned that EVs aren’t economical to run on public chargers, bought them anyway and then complain about how expensive an EV is to run.
Own your mistakes. Things like this sentence:
I realise that the stated bhp is a bit of a joke as you only get it when you floor it with a charged battery and the engine kicks in
.. yeah? What else would you suggest? State the petrol only bhp? State the electric only bhp? What’s the alternative? You can’t give people like you the actual precise numbers either because then two days later you come back to the dealership complaining that on the dyno, the car made a noticeably smaller number than motor+engine numbers should add up to – naturally, considering they peak their power at different ranges on the revband – so the actual numbers are completely meaningless, what matters is the combined horsepower – and that’s the number you get quoted.
Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19, VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23
Current: Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
Next: we'll see what's available in 2028.
