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I wish everyone happy debating but I am going to conclude with this post. For me there have been too many unsavoury and provocative posts and I no longer wish to contribute to this or be part of it.
I thought this thread was quite subdued compared to its predecessor. Something that you may or may not notice is that the electorate in Scotland is wide awake. Political debate can get a bit more heated than down south although Brexit is turning more people off than on. The debate up here focuses on Independence as much as Brexit and this despite the SNP not really mentioning it much. The Tory party in Scotland mentions it every day when they say the SNP should stop “banging” on about Independence when they are the ones who raise it in the first place.
I hope England and Wales get the Brexit they voted for but I also think that Scotland should get a say in its implementation here. If we have to go our separate ways to achieve this then so be it.
I think that if I was an EU negotiator, or EU head of state, I would have given up a long time ago. The UK “team” is a joke. They don’t know what they want, they don’t know when they want it, they don’t know how to get what they might want, and they don’t know what they will do with it if they get it, or not. Need to order in more popcorn.
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“@andy52“Fintan O’Toole, you should read some of his ramblings, brilliant book ‘Heroic Failure’”
I read a lot of his articles in The Guardian and Irish Times. A voice of sanity in an increasingly insane world. Unlike the UK press, he actually writes and doesn’t just recycle party press handouts.
Statistics tell a story, but other matters can too, and of course, whilst they might be taken in a contextual format, offer a deeper and less nuanced view of matters which, if presented to a less than generous mind in circumstances less prevalent to the majority view result in a different, and perhaps, erroneous conclusion. I though I should clarify that in case of doubt.
I agree. Statistics are only a part of the story. England decided it wanted to leave because, among other things, they did not like laws imposed on them by the EU. For England read Scotland, and for the EU read England. Exactly the same sentiments. Scots are becoming increasingly aware that Westminster will always do what is in England’s interests and we can do nothing about it. The huge built in English majority will always ensure that it is so.
Independence, and a real parliament in Edinburgh would allow us to elect politicians whose arses are within kicking distance should they get it wrong. This country has so much to offer its citizens if only we had control of our own destiny.
And just in case you think I am one of those English hating Scots, I was born and brought up in Beeston, Leeds and I still enjoy watching the cricket, that bastion of Englishness.
You think? Latvia is currently the third-poorest country in the European Union and about 30,000 people leave the country each year…
It’s actually the fourth poorest but the EU will invest and improve that. England could end up in the the same boat if Scotland ends the Union. Look at Ireland before it joined the EU, and look at it now. It outstrips the UK in almost every economic area.
The two biggest export earners in the UK, apart from financial services, are whisky and oil. Guess which country has both in abundance. Guess which country exports electricity to keep the south running. Guess which country is self sufficient in food and energy production. Where’s 90% of the UK’s water? Loch Ness contains more water than every lake in England combined. But we were told in the last Independence referendum that England would no longer trade with us. We’ll see in the next year or two how quickly that attitude changes.
Westminster tells you that we are subsidised by England yet they resort to very underhand tactics to stop Scotland going its own way. Have you ever thought why that is? Do some homework and you will see why.
……..And to Andy, if I’ve offended a Scottish Nationalist by describing Latvia as a tinpot country, I apologise.
You’ve not offended me but I reckon a lot of Latvians might be a bit put out.
Which “tinpot” country would that be? I assume you are talking about a member of the EU which would suggest it might be a democracy. As a member of the EU, that country has a say in how it is run, just the same as the UK does. Foreign does not equal tinpot. There are many countries which are much better run, and are much more democratic than the UK.
The UK had a say in how the EU is run but leaver propaganda made sure that we were told it was a dictatorship and made laws which overuled both English and Scots law. Rubbish! There is only one organisation which does this and that is Westminster. They show a total disrespect for Scots law which is now biting back big time. This coming week will bring some more interesting developments in that respect but don’t expect the BBC or the papers to keep you fully informed about it. They have their own agenda.
The one thing which has stood out over the last three years is that nobody who voted leave knew exactly what they were voting for. We see this in all the different interpretations of “leave” which have been bandied about since the referendum vote which, in case you forget, was advisory. Like all revolutions over the years in various countries, this one has been hijacked by those who sniff power and profit.
“Take back control” they said. What they didn’t tell you that it would not be YOU in control, not even your elected parliament. A bunch of right wing psychopaths led by a proven serial liar will be dictating the progress of democracy in the UK and YOU are not high up on their list of priorities. The offshore accounts of these politicians and their backers must be protected first and that is what Brexit was always about. New EU regulations would mean that these accounts could no longer be hidden so Brexit had to be arranged.
A couple of court cases presently in progress in Scotland could be interesting. Next week’s verdicts may put a whole new perspective on Brexit.
Scotland has a lifeboat to escape from this madness and I hope that this time we actually use it instead of staying aboard as the good ship UK hits the rocks, as it will.
So in answer to the question posed by the OP I would answer “Yes, please”.
PS The UK is not a country, it is a state made up of two countries and another few bits.
England voted leave. Scotland, N. Ireland and Gibraltar voted to remain. Independence for England would solve the problem but they would be skint.
I looked at the title of this thread and thought, “I f*****g hope so”. This government is a disaster and the UK will go down the tubes after Brexit, the most stupid decision this country has made since it joined in WW1 and killed millions. The Tories have a long way to go to beat this but they seem to be having a go with benefit claimants dying every week due to policies designed to weed out the weakest and save on the “benefits” bill.
Scotland has different ideas about its future and I truly hope that more people realise this and vote for a future in Europe on our own terms, not those of a bunch of billionaire chancers who control the Westminster politicians. They are the only ones who will benefit from Brexit and they have led the UK a merry dance on the slippery slope to a future controlled by big business and the US.
Please, independence now!
