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Mike700 we are not going to agree on this matter.
I think we have seen enough to each draw our own conclusions just as the world has come to a judgement on Trumps handling of Covid in the USA.
I really do hope things turn around but I’m not holding my breath.
Best to agree to disagree.
Mike700, DAF has appointed himself speaker for the world! By the way this is way way off-topic. I have no doubt February 9th will bring plenty to discuss on-topic!
the thing with many usa states is wigwam they are huge, populations are spread out which lessons the impact of rule breaking and reduces the need for lockdowns. california relaxed its rules and look what happened their rate has rocketed.
as has been said we will only know the result at the end and all the bickering by politicians and the hot air from the consiracy theorists etc just muddy the waters.
i dont think there is one solution for all, countries are so different some with vast land tracts and small population centres and others with huge population centres and suburbs that end up like petri dishes.
lets hope the vaccines get out there quickly and they work.
it may be the one thing we got right.
Mike700 we are not going to agree on this matter. I think we have seen enough to each draw our own conclusions just as the world has come to a judgement on Trumps handling of Covid in the USA. I really do hope things turn around but I’m not holding my breath. Best to agree to disagree.
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Mike700, DAF has appointed himself speaker for the world! By the way this is way way off-topic. I have no doubt February 9th will bring plenty to discuss on-topic!
Is it off topic?
Well, the question was ‘ which one is lying’?
I think that we all agree that the answer is all politicians lie, some to great effect ?
I also think most will agree, that as a public relations exercise , Ms. Sturgeon Is on a winner with her daily Corona Virus update?
– however, during which she very successfully manages to perpetuate the lies about Independence, BoJo and the hated Westminster Government.
Regards
Don’t pout Wigwam you made a few mistakes which could have been rectified with a simple acknowledgement.
Yes it will be interesting to see how it all pans out. Nicholas Sturgeon is a canny politician and more than a match for whats currently in Westminster. Salmon has also been about a bit and I think the gloves will be off.
Seems Joanna Cherry picked the wrong side in the Salmond v Sturgeon battle. She’s been sacked from the SNP front bench.
Seems strange that this important event in Scottish politics hasn’t make BBC Scotland’s six o’clock news. Or so I hear…
It was on my TV wigwam.
Lots of SNP infighting going on, just as we’re so close to securing a vote for independence, not good.
BBC 1
BBC1Reporting Scotland.
Yes I expect to hear a lot of truths, half turns and lies, certainly not what I wanted before the upcoming Holyrood elections.
I’m looking for an SNP majority to force the London government to grant us an independence referendum “please sir can we have some more”
If there is a second referendum, I expect a much closer vote. I don’t see Boris granting one however. On a separate issue it looks like Celtic’s stranglehold of the Premier league is over after many years. I follow Inverness Caledonian Thistle after a holiday in the highlands although they seem to be struggling a bit.
Rejoining the EU could take four or five years for an independent Scotland if procedures were carried out at the fastest pace, a report has said. Maybe even a decade or longer and you’d have to adopt the euro to join as all new members do..
Who know’s if scotland as an independant nation would meet the requirements, plus then you would have to show you can meet the criteria as a new independant nation before applying to join the eu.. To show them you meet the criteria they setout for joining.. Just like other countries have had to do to join the eu..now and in the past.. AS we know it takes the Eu a longtime to do very little.
What i don’t get is why would you leave the uk to sign up to to brussels and one only has to look at the eu vaccine mess to see why you better out of the eu political union than in it.. plus Scotland’s implicit budget deficit could be around 26-28% of GDP in 2020-21, plus then there’s the eu packages they put in place for covid for the current 27, so i don’t think they gonna be in a position for more countries to join that could be a drain on the block. what if then the eu says no you cannot join and you left the uk. who about to join other free trade deals and area’s around the globe.
The question is what if you do have indyref2 and the vote is to remain part of the uk, all things now being considered. Have A 3rd vote and a 4th/5th until it happens.
Once in a generation we was told. oh brexit happened so we should have another vote to leave, everytime a vote goes against what we want/ what we don’t like.. lets have another vote.. Great model of democracy that. The EU Model, not that i believe in it at all anyways.. we all controlled by someone or something and there could well be a hard border.
Will scotlland be able to stand on it’s own two feet without being part of the uk, free this and that will be out the window plus all that oil and gas will be no use at all.. from falling revenues. but hey ho over a cliff you go… seems as if it did not happen when we left the eu did it… covid did that to us all..
I don’t want to upset Brydo, but the chances of the current UK government allowing another referendum on Scottish independence are zero. All other considerations are irrelevant.
Wigwam you saying this doesn’t upset me as what you say, and the rest of us, is only an opinion and will not make what you say more or less likely to happen.
Boris saying it, on the other hand, a man known for his word, who never wavers or changes his mind, also makes absolute no difference.
The Scottish people will decide if we have another independence vote by either returning the SNP with a majority in the upcoming election or not. The result of this vote will decide whether or not another Indy vote is on the cards as the SNP are offering this as their main policy, so if you vote SNP you are voting for independence, no its butts or maybe. If the SNP are returned with fewer votes then it would leave the pro independence lobby in a much, much weaker position.
The fact we need to asks permission for another vote is nothing short of disgraceful.
How would the English people had felt if they had to ask the EU for permission to hold a brexit vote and even more how would you have felt if they refused?
Brydo I can’t see why you think what stands for every other country on this planet doesn’t stand for the UK. There is no right giving any part of a country to leave it unlaterally.
The EU of course is of no relevance, the option to leave is enshrined in the Treaties.
So let’s put it this way, the English people decide they’ve had enough of the Scots, Welsh and Irish but they can’t vote on it unless the other three agree to let them. Or do they just decide to have a vote anyway as the English Parliament and Westminster are the same thing.
There would need to be an Act passed through the UK Parliament to repeal the Acts of Union of 1707 and the later Act re Northern Ireland, I would think. Hard to imagine the circumstances where such a move would win a majority in the House.
Brydo, if by a vote you mean a referendum to separate England, then again the UK Parliament would have to pass an enabling Act which they would not do.
You had your once in a generation vote and the Scottish people decided 55 to 45 ( of those who voted) not to be independent.
As always wigwam you miss the point, probably by design.
No can’t be bothered.
The fact is the British empire has always blustered threatened and eventually agreed to the will of the citizens of its colonies. It has happened 65 times so far and I have no doubt that in the near future Scotland will join that number. Geography and the laws of the Imperial Country will count for nought compared to the will of the Scottish people. History is littered with the remnants of Empires that have disintegrated because of the will of the people.
I cannot envisage Westminster resorting to force or indeed offering a form of Devo-max which would have to be so close to Independence as to be indistinguishable. So yes Brydo I wouldnt open the champers quite yet but the move towards Scottish Independence is a unstoppable force which has been propelled by Brexit. It is ironic that a decision to leave the EU against the wishes of the Scottish people will result in Scotland finally regaining control over it’s own affairs and join the family of Nations.
I look forward to joining you Brydo in toasting the future success of an Independent Scotland.
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