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This doesn’t surprise me at all;
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We have a PHEV the best of both world, just in case.
Unfortunately I have suffered a brain injury and occasionally say the wrong thing.
Nope, in for a penny in for a pound as they say.
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Hyundai Ioniq 6 Ultimate
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Scale modeller in my spare time
----------------------------I was thinking about this yesterday,if i get an EV and then there is WW3 and electricity is no longer available,a small engined ICE car would do as you would be able to scavenge fuel from lots of places and keep on the move.
We’ve got an ICE car too but it’s not for “back up” ?♂️ it’s just we’re a 2 car household and it isn’t worth changing a 12 year old diesel with 100k on it that does everything we need and works perfectly ?
I guess it depends on what you use a car for.
Should I decide to try an EV n the scheme, I would keep my own car as a back up for longer journeys, especially those where decent public chargers are limited and less so these days being a 2 car household.
I have a second car, but it’s a TVR so hardly a reliable backup if anything went wrong haha
Which actually needs to be sold as I have no chance of driving it anymore
We are a three car family, and two are ICE cars, but for very valid reasons, one is my 22 year old’s Fiesta which he us building up his NCB and evs insurance w9ukd be more than the car.
The other is a Range Rover f9r the wife’s equestrian work and towing.
<p style=”text-align: left;”>I’m just about to pick up my first ev and I don’t feel the need for a back up car. I probably do at most 6 trips a year that are over 150 miles round-trip and even then due to my disabilities I need to stop every hour or so, so I have no problems with rapid charging. I’d much rather do that a few times a year than go to a petrol station 60 times a year to fill my car with petrol. Although I don’t drive long distances much I drive lots of short distances several times a day just to distract from pain, so a full tank (40L) only lasts 6 days. Then there’s the cost, people moan about paying 80p per kwh to rapid charge but I’m more than happy with that for the convenience, plus the savings I make through the rest off the year will be massive. I currently pay £56 every 6 days for 40 litres of petrol, which on average gets me 265 miles, charging at home saying I average 3 miles per kwh at 7.5p per kwh it would cost me £6.63. So to summarise, I’ll save over £2500 a year after allowing for what little rapid charging I’ll do, I’ll spend around 3 hours at rapid chargers compared with a very optimistic 5 hours at petrol stations (60x5min).</p>
I do understand that ev’s aren’t for everyone and a few years ago I wouldn’t have gave one a second thought but for me it’s the perfect option now.As for WW3, I can remember not so long ago having to drive around searching for petrol stations and then only being allowed to buy £10 due to fuel shortages because of covid. You can produce your own electricity, its a lot harder to make your own petrol!
Nissan Leaf here, max 100 miles range on motorway if we lucky, chademo max 50kWh DC charging (usually average 20kWh). Home charging 3 pin socket in borrowed my neighbor driveway.
Its all depends where you driving and family or alone. We drive 90% city, but now first time ordered Bz4x. So we want to travel now, because we want our autistic son help get out of room. My son and wife are ICE fans, but I convinced them that with new CCS around 70-140kWh charging speed is matter of “time=bladder” calculations.
Average our motorway speed is 55-60mph, according car trip meter. Average my family bladder hold 1.5-2h.
So… Im taking calculator (brains degraded because of smartphones) and got “family range” 80-120 miles. Average “toilets-snacks-meal” time in motorway services is 20-40min.All good.
This has an odour of misrepresenting statistics.
I’d fully expect half, if not more, to have a 2nd car that isn’t an EV. Not as cover for long distance driving but because the two adults in the house work separately. One can take the children and go to work via school/childcare, the other straight to work. That’s not anti-EV enough though.
For a multitude of reasons, most families will have one large and expensive car and one smaller and, probably, older one. They are also unlikely to use the latter for holidays/long trips as it’ll either be less reliable or unsuitable for taking the whole family far. Now add in that the first car is an EV and nothing else changes. Unless you’re wealthy enough to afford 2 new cars every 3-5 years, one car will be older and cheaper and the other newer, more reliable and usually bigger. That newer, bigger vehicle takes the whole family away, the other takes one family member, possibly with a child or two, on short trips. Only those who are buying 2 cars will have one large and expensive EV (potentially thanks to a Salary Sacrifice type scheme) and one cheaper, smaller EV, and they’ll be few and far between, not because of anything EV related other than the up front cost and anticipated depreciation as it’s currently viewed.
What I’d like to see is what that picture looks like with various break downs, like both parents working in companies with Salary Sacrifice schemes or both with PIP and Motability or anything else that provides a reasonably priced option to get into the right position to be a dual EV (or more) family. Even down here in Cornwall, I know of one household where the parents both have EVs, one Tesla and an ID3, the son has just passed his test and has a Leaf 40, which has enough range but was a pretty cheap option. I also know entire housing estates where there’s nobody in anything newer than 5 years old and most cars are 10-15 years old and pretty knackered.
I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.Mark
Both of my daughter’s husbands have ICE cars and both daughters have BEVs. As said above there will be a variety of reasons for having one of each.
When they go on long journeys one takes the ICE the other takes the BEV.
I really thought we had left all the anti-BEV talk behind us as no matter what anyone says we will virtually all be driving one within the next ten years.
The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.We’ve been a two BEV family for three years with no ICE backup. Even though our cars are shorter range (My BMW i3s and wife’s Mini-e) we go from Surrey to Northumberland twice a year using public charging.
It’s honestly fine. Yes, it’s more inconvenient to stop more times to charge, but I’ll take that for the rest of the year when our cars are charged overnight and I don’t have to visit fuel stations and get diesel all over my wheelchair wheels (that stuff is horrible).
I know of one household where the parents both have EVs, one Tesla and an ID3, the son has just passed his test and has a Leaf 40
This also highligts another issue with multi EV family’s especially where charging is concerned from a single phase domestic supply.
Essentially you are sharing what is already a slow 7.2kW charger between two or more users. If two of you want to charge overnight at the same time and have a linked charger installed, each car is now charging at 3.6kW as load sharing is required. If another member of the family then decides they need to charge at the same time and decide to have another linked charger, which then means all 3 cars are now charging at a snails pace of 2,4kW each.
What are the options,
Beg the DNO to install three phase which would likely incur a hefty sum because they already have a first chrger installed.
Have a 32A commando socket fitted so, one member from the household can charge at 7.2kw and the other two members at 36kW each or two members charging at 7.2kW, whilst telling the third to wait.
I was thinking about this yesterday,if i get an EV and then there is WW3 and electricity is no longer available,a small engined ICE car would do as you would be able to scavenge fuel from lots of places and keep on the move.
Interesting “walking Dead” look at ww3.
As we don’t produce our ien fuel and refineries w9uld ge on the enemus h7t l7st, fuel would be rationed straight away, plus fuels degrade over a short-time six months as I recall, sofurpel woukd fe a short term solution, jot to forget there will be some really nasty people out there making sure they get their hands on it, I would rather obtain a house on a hill (I’ve already scoped one out lol) with solar panels and run an ev than a ice car
I know of one household where the parents both have EVs, one Tesla and an ID3, the son has just passed his test and has a Leaf 40
This also highligts another issue with multi EV family’s especially where charging is concerned from a single phase domestic supply. Essentially you are sharing what is already a slow 7.2kW charger between two or more users. If two of you want to charge overnight at the same time and have a linked charger installed, each car is now charging at 3.6kW as load sharing is required. If another member of the family then decides they need to charge at the same time and decide to have another linked charger, which then means all 3 cars are now charging at a snails pace of 2,4kW each. What are the options, Beg the DNO to install three phase which would likely incur a hefty sum because they already have a first chrger installed. Have a 32A commando socket fitted so, one member from the household can charge at 7.2kw and the other two members at 36kW each or two members charging at 7.2kW, whilst telling the third to wait.
You’re overthinking this one. In reality the Tesla sees the charger weekly at most, the ID3 probably less as it only does local runs, so a full ‘tank’ can see the school runs plus commute for 8/9 days and the Leaf still does 100 miles which is 3 or 4 days. So the leaf is plugged in pretty much every other night. The ID3 and Tesla can fit in around that one.
The owners will look at who’s plugged in once they’re below 50% and can jump in at the next available evening. A little bit of communication between the family and it’s all good off one charger.
There are households with 2 chargers off one supply but I guess they get throttled if they’re both plugged in. I do know of a family in a rather well off situation where they’ve a huge cluster of solar panels and batteries galore and one charger works exclusively off that battery source. So one car will charge off the battery and the impatient one gets mains electricity.
I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.Mark
We’ve literally been using a 3.5kw charger for three years shared between the two of us. It really hasn’t been an issue at all.
My wife needs to charge twice a week, which happens overnight. I’ll charge mine when she isn’t. We don’t do mega miles, but not a single time have we both needed the charger at the same time – ever.
We’ve just had our OHME 7kw charger installed so now it’s even easier.
I really thought we had left all the anti-BEV talk behind us as no matter what anyone says we will virtually all be driving one within the next ten years.
Why is it anti BEV to talk about the reality of what is happening? You’ve been advocating BEVs for as long as I can remember yet, as far as I recall, you’ve not switched to one yourself (Volvo PHEV if I recall, but I’ll stand corrected if I’m wrong), probably for the same sort of reasons that the vast majority of motorists haven’t. I can see me getting one before you ?
If you don’t like reading about the challenges that the BEV market is facing at the moment then it’s probably best to avoid reading any trade info, or any news at all for that matter, as it’s full of it, especially with sales to private buyers having gone into reverse for the first time, resale value woes and rental companies who had embraced BEVs now ditching them and going back to ICE. For these and many other reasons (not least being that the average age of cars on our roads is 9 years old – and that’s the average, so there are as many older than that as younger) and you don’t have to be a mathematician to work out that it’s going to be considerably more than 10 years until we are virtually all driving one. Far more like 30 years, and I probably won’t still be driving by then!
@ Glos Guy What has anything of that got to do with the Motability Scheme ?
Entirely relevant when many of us are weighing up the pros and cons of EVs, given Motability’s desire to get us all in one. Of course, if it’s not of interest to you please just ignore it, as I do the countless threads that are of no interest whatsoever to me.
No it’s not we’re Motability customers not private buyers. Residuals and insurance costs and the like are of no interest to me, I’m just renting a car. It’s funny that a couple of people who have no interest in electric cars have the most to say on them.
@Glos Guy
Why are you so anti ev?
Why?
Like the vast majority of EV owners, I’ve had ICE cars for many years and find my BEV to be amazing to own and drive. Silent, no vibration or noise, smooth power delivery. It’s genuinely lovely to drive.
I’ve even stated that even in a low range EV (BMW i3s) it’s genuinely not a massive problem if you need to drive long distances.
And I say that with three years experience.
It always seems like people who’ve never owned a BEV seem to know best. Why is that?
I’ll never go back to ICE.
Looking at our family, my in-laws have a Bev, a new BYD Design from Motability, no driveway, charge at a local hub once a week or so.
We have a Bev, Kia Soul, next car is very likely to also be a Bev via the scheme.
Son also has a Bev, an MG ZS he traded his Duster for. He’s loving it.
I am not a Bev evangelist, get whatever vehicle floats your boat & it does annoy me that diesel versions of cars were dropped from the scheme, reducing choice and pushing small engined large cars with fuel economy way off their alleged WLTP.
In life, it's not who you know that's important, it's how your wife found out.
I am not “anti EV”. If we stay with Motability there’s a chance that we might get one. Whilst I’d prefer a petrol car, the choice of those is extremely poor and there is no doubt that the best cars on the scheme at the moment are EVs.
I’ll tell you what I am anti though, and that’s the defensiveness that some display whenever anything that they deem to be ‘negative’ against them is mentioned. At times this even borders on bullying, in order to shut down any debate.
Personally, I find the whole EV debate very interesting. I shall be fascinated to see how it all pans out in the years ahead, as governments are attempting to push people in a direction that the majority do not wish to go in for perfectly understandable reasons.
As Motability customers we are fortunate that, high APs aside, we don’t have the high acquisition costs to worry about, nor issues such as depreciation, charger installation costs etc. Those who can charge at home can make big savings on running costs and of course I get why that is an attraction.
But let’s not just have a blinkered one sided discussion that extols their virtues without acknowledging their down sides. Most of all, let’s not be afraid of an adult discussion.
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