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iv just filled up my 65 xc60 awd diesel at costco it was £65 but there was still fuel in it to start about 130 miles.
i would like and electric car but as most EV’s get about 200 to a full charge and i know most of us don’t need 200 miles every day it did make me think at what do you start panicking about have enough fuel in the car, my dad was old school and didn’t want to get dirt in the engine so when it got to half a tank he filled it up. Iv watch YouTube where people have go 6 miles left of charge and the nearest charger in 8 miles away Do you just start panicing when you get in the EV Iv only going 200 miles to go to asda up the road and back
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Please can you clarify what you’re asking?
sorry simon i didn’t make it clear , no too sure exactly, it just was a lot of miles in my full tank (700) compared to an EV.
Maybe something like :-
(1) At what do you start to panic about have enough fuel in the car, when you have half a tank to empty , or 10 mile to empty, when do you feel you need to put fuel in?.
(2) If you got an Ev that only did 200 miles to a full charge would you be anxious about have enough charge in the car or would you only start to be anxious once you’ve only got 8 miles or so left?.
hope this is a bit clearer , but probably not
I dont understand people that worry about sucking up crap when the car gets low dont they realise that the fuel is taken from the bottom of the tank at all times.I have a ford focus st diesel 2.0 i can drive with my fuel tank coming up with 0.0 and i know i can go around another 20 miles how do i know! every time i get a new car second hand or new i fill up a can of appropriate fuel and go for a drive when it says 20 miles remaining when i run out i put fuel in and i know where i stand if i am to be caught out more or less it stems to when i bought a nice new A plate xr3i in 1984 my first new car as i was blowing all my mates away in my car the fuel consumption was crap i remember we was all going out on a friday drive and my car said a quater of a tank and i ran out of fuel felt really bad turned out to be a sender unit issue changed under warrenty the mechanic suggested to do it as its what he did to check the unit.
With the electric car you currently need to plan the refuels a lot better, for instance I was planning a possible journey to see my parents, a distance of 266 miles and I’ll be wanting to drive sufficiently fast so will want two stops in the electric car on the journey. I found a new bank of Instavolt chargers has just appeared near my planned first stop, so, instead of waiting for a single rapid charger or finding it broken, I’ll be able to pull up to the bank of 8 rapid chargers & hopefully at least some of them will be working…. this is a major thing in the UK, finding chargers that are reliable & that are free to use when you arrive. Finding a bank of 8 just off a motorway junction is a major step forward (M40 J11 – Instavolt – 125kW Rapid chargers, so that cuts maybe 20 minutes off my journey time). 1st step of the journey is 103 miles & I’ll be leaving with 100% charge from home, so I can cruise at 70mph no problem.
When it comes to the second step of that journey, it’s a single 50kW rapid charger, it may be in use when I arrive, it may be broken, this is where the range anxiety would kick in, so I’m looking for a better option or other chargers nearby.
In the diesel I would simply fill up at the start of each journey, no range anxiety.
On the motorbike I’d ride it down to maybe 40 miles left in the tank before looking for the petrol station. Motorbike ranges are similar to the current crop of electric cars.
266 miles, and needing two top-ups.
… and this is the way forward?
Martino the question of a full tank of diesel with a 700 range is great…. but when do you ever travel 700 miles in the uk in a single trip. I never have in my life.
The vast majority of people do 80% of their journeys within a 20 mile radius of where they live.
Therefore an Ev with a 200 mile capability is sufficient for the vast majority of car drivers.
The only draw back I can imagine with an ev is the occasional holiday break when I travel 150 miles away… so I would plan my stop in an electric vehicle to area which has charging points, and let the vehicle charge whilst i have a comfort break.
Most of my trips longest trips are for example are 30 mile round trip to the hospital….I could do that journey 6 times a week before needing a change- and for convenience you chage up at home and not a local petrol station. Win win really I guess and in this type of scenario you have no range anxiety as you can top up the battery at home whenever you feel like it.
A diesel car would not be suitable for a sales rep who does hundreds of miles every up and down the country! So it’s a matter of perspective.
The last paragraph should read a diesel car would be suitable for a sales rep…
700 miles per top-up is much more convenient, especially for anyone with severe mobility issues.
It’s not necessarily a point of 700 miles per trip, but maybe topping-up once every month-or-two.
If I’m just pottering around locally I usually refill when I have 100 miles left (petrol Golf). It usually only takes 5 minutes to fill the tank while I’m out anyway. Less if I Pay at the Pump.
Tony and Georgie great points raised, but surely nothing is more convenient than topping up the electric battery at home whenever u feel like it, rather than having to go to a petrol station?
Clearly, it’s not suitable for everyone as you need a drive way to put your charging port. So anyone in a flat complex or terrace street will struggle with this.
266 miles, and needing two top-ups. … and this is the way forward?
That’s 2 comfort stops with rapid recharging whilst we grab a coffee (1st stop as it’s a 125kW charger so 20 minute stop) and a bite to eat (2nd stop as it’s only a 50kW charger so 35 minute stop).
It’s still relatively early in EV development, people are still working out what size batteries are needed & the above journey can easily be done on two charges, but, with the way that batteries work these charges are to under 80% as the really fast charging will be between 10-75% of battery state of charge. The battery will be 100% SOC at the start of the journey from an overnight charge where time isn’t an issue. Three charges (the overnight slow plus the 2 rapid) is the right balance as it ties the stops into the 2 hour mark, so drive for 2 hours then charge for 20 minutes, drive for 2 hours then charge for 35 minutes. There’s more to a journey than refueling in any car.
Costs is another thing that could be included in the calculations, as we know the cost of electricity varies, from the 5p per kW/h of the home on overnight charge, to the 69p per kW/h of an Ionity charger that won’t be on this route. 1st stop is 35p per kW/h and the second is 15p per kW/h. I don’t select specific rapid chargers due to cost on such a journey because I’m looking for the best journey times rather than cost, the cost comes in when charging nearer home during the course of journeys I make much more frequently. So, 5p per kW/h and 15p per kW/h is fine, 69p per kW/h at Ionity isn’t going to happen when I can use the nearby Polar ultra rapid for 19p per kW/h and achieve the same charge speed.
Now all this calculation to be able to make journeys seems complex, and it would be without a few apps, the one that is making things easier is A Better Route Planner, and it allows for fuel costs, charge speeds, and even wind direction & strength, in its calculations. You can even have the app redirect you to another charger when someone else is charging on your first choice of charger.
If you really want range anxiety then you can program ABRP so that it tells you to drive below a certain speed on each journey leg to achieve the desired range between chargers, I plotted a journey to the North Cape in Norway, it found a leg between chargers that required a full 100% charge & a speed of 45mph just to be able to complete, the alternative was to re-route the last 1000 miles switching from Swedish to Norwegian roads with the lower speeds & the ferries. I’d take the more scenic route through Norway on a once in a lifetime trip.
In further consideration of @gothitjulie ‘s comments regarding the 266 mile trip which needed “2 comfort stops with rapid recharging”.
From my own personal requirements on such a journey distance, I would normally only require one stop as a maximum; and it would be where I wanted, not where it needed to be as deemed necessary by the car.
Clearly you have immense understanding of EV’s and their operational costs, etc, which I assume to be far greater than many people; but for me, filling up with a liquid fuel every half-thousand miles at one of eight-thousand-plus ‘fully operational’ outlets with a multitude of nozzles at each will suit my needs for a few years yet.
I do understand the need to change to EV’s, but I find all the mathematics, calculations and metric-units too much for my elderly brain to comprehend. Sticking a nozzle into a hole in the car, pull a trigger and press a button-or-two; and then pay by card – I can cope with.
Good luck EVers.
I can remember when I first started driving car recorded on average 25 to 30 mpg only the Mini and Hillman Imp achieved nearer the 40 mpg, fuel tanks on Mini’ and Imp’s around 5 gallons and other 1300 -1600cc cars 8 – 9 gallons max, 200 miles on a tank of fuel in those days was good going.
Now we have affordable cars coming on the market like :https://www.drivingelectric.com/peugeot/3008/1936/new-peugeot-3008-electric-due-2023-404-mile-range
Unfortunately I have suffered a brain injury and occasionally I get confused and often say the wrong thing.
In any “which is better” question the answer will always be highly dependent on personal circumstances. So, I can’t ever be in a car for much over 2 hours without my pain getting excruciating. Therefore an electric vehicle which has a real 160 mile range presents no additional complexities to journey planning. However, our nearest petrol station is a return journey of about 40 minutes and so the prospect of being able to recharge at home is very appealing. I also have to say that living in what would be considered a remote area means there is no easy access to the cheapest fuel which means that savings will be even more than the average. So, at 4p a mile for the 700 miles mentioned the cost would be £28 giving a saving of around £37! I really do hope that a suitable electric vehicle will be an option when I next change cars.
Less fuel is less weight to lug around, why one would fill the tank fully if you not doing a long journey amuses me abit he he ha ha.. It’s not as if i cannot get fuel 24hrs a day If i need to go somewhere far in a hurry.
Also carryng stuff around in the boot that’s not needed that also effects performance and mpg and a hot lap racing is done with the least amount of fuel in the tank. I think my new honda civic only has a 45l tank but for me all this electric stuff is not fun at all.. It’s restrictive and being forced upon us from many angles and imo it’s all designed to limit our abilty to drive overtime as is setout in UN agenda 21. Just like how face mask wearing is being rolled out to more and more places. soon it will be as soon as you stepout of your front door you must wear one. Because of my mental issues i don’t wear one. I’m except.
The point is they introduce it slowly and often offer the carrot rather than a stick at first. Someone always gains from it all.. we the masses lose out and lose our freedoms.
The duty the goverment has already lost from less ice cars in lockdown on the roads and uptake of elec means soon we will be paying a duty per mile we drive, a congestion tax. Regardless of mode..
Who’s pushing the uptake as well.. This is what i wonder and look i’m not against the others who like it and it works for them, but for me if i am told i must do this. i will not do it.. No one can make me.. I will come to my own conclusions like reading un agenda 21 or un treaties who’s done that.. They available on there sites and it says, drivers should pay for the demise of the car. It’s about sustainabilty even the family structure is not sustainable. Anyhow going off topic or am all it’s all part of the plan, everything is not what they say. when you start looking following the money you see what is really going on.
Electric range is the biggest problem for me two forced comfort stops is something i could not do, again i must stop there.. captive till i’m charged enough to leave and get to the next place i am captive and for me because of the brain damage i suffered when i was 9 I have many issues with that.
I think they need to consider exchangable batteries like gas calor bottlles and you can add them on for longer journeys, take a few off for around town so you got less weight etc. then it may work for me.
I want to see more hydro tech rather than elec as who benefits and supplys it..
I do want a BEV now and for a very good reason. I really considered it this time but decided it was not feasible given where I live.
I do feel that the ‘range anxiety’ label that is being used is unfair as I think it’s not anxiety per se but a plain fact that you may not be able to complete a journey or at least need to have military planning to do so. And this can’t be fun.
That said, as I’ve said before AND the reason I say I’d like one now is that I really do believe that now will be remembered as the best time to run an BEV. And I say this for two reasons;1) The grants out there are going to disappear. Those of us who are rural are going to suffer cost wise. And,
b) All governments are going to need to recoup lost revenue from ICE fuel taxes as the switchover happens. This can only mean higher tariffs for home charging.
Did anyone spot my Clarksonesqe blooper?
? I will be remembered for nothing but had great fun doing it ?
“This can only mean higher tariffs for home charging.”
Or we could get changed by the miles driven.
Either way, the Government are going to find a way to recoup the £billions they currently get every year from ICE fuel sales. Once enough of us are using Electric vehicles the heavy ‘Taxation’, by whatever means, will kick in.
I have to be honest, I originally thought the OP was asking about cost. How much to drive a given mileage?
So, I know there are a few very clever people here who know their BEV’s so perhaps……..?
My X1 will conservatively get 49mpg so over 560 miles, it costs me £61.
How does an average BEV fare over the same distance?I’ve tried using the calculator on Zapmap but it’s so biased it’s unreal. It calculated for my car at almost twice the cost using WLTP.
Has anyone actually costed it up using real numbers? I’d love to know what the saving really is……..at the moment.?? I will be remembered for nothing but had great fun doing it ?
“This can only mean higher tariffs for home charging.” Or we could get changed by the miles driven. Either way, the Government are going to find a way to recoup the £billions they currently get every year from ICE fuel sales. Once enough of us are using Electric vehicles the heavy ‘Taxation’, by whatever means, will kick in.
Sorry, I actually meant that at some point soon the taxes that would be lost will have be recovered. So EV charging will become quite a lot more expensive, wherever you charge. ?
? I will be remembered for nothing but had great fun doing it ?
Yes
By the time range improves, charging is quick and available everywhere then government will need to be clawing in tax from EV motorists.
It’s only the intrepid few Motability EV guinea pigs that will currently make massive savings on fuel costs, but hats off to them if they can do it.
Make hay while the sun shines, but we will all get there in the next five or so years at a more sustainable cost to the government!
Good points made. I think as stated above, you have to choose a vehicle which fits your own personal circumstances.
For me EV could work, so I am having an extended 2 day test drive next week to satisfy myself of this fact. For me the deciding factor was the reduction in global air pollution when lockdown happened and everyone stopped driving cars! Surely, we owe it to our environment to do our bit if at all possible.
Carl
I agree with what you say, but the disabled probably can’t all be at the forefront of EV driving, there are so many other considerations for them. It will happen for all eventually.
“This can only mean higher tariffs for home charging.” Or we could get changed by the miles driven. Either way, the Government are going to find a way to recoup the £billions they currently get every year from ICE fuel sales. Once enough of us are using Electric vehicles the heavy ‘Taxation’, by whatever means, will kick in.
Sorry, I actually meant that at some point soon the taxes that would be lost will have be recovered. So EV charging will become quite a lot more expensive, wherever you charge. ?
I have to agree the tax revenue will have to be clawed back at some stage, I cant see some sort of tariffs per mile using some satellite technology ?
Unfortunately I have suffered a brain injury and occasionally I get confused and often say the wrong thing.
The above post should have read can not cant
Unfortunately I have suffered a brain injury and occasionally I get confused and often say the wrong thing.
Just worked mine out this morning. 3500 miles at a cost of £105. Petrol here is £1.069 per litre so £4.86 per gallon. 21.6 gallons to do 3500 miles means an average mpg of 162. What’s not to like?
Off to Scotland in a couple of weeks with rapid charging available all over, free to use. Around 1,000 miles for no charge is ace in my book.
Yes, a bit more planning needed but nothing difficult as apps on my phone do the hard work.
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