Jeez, what a kerfuffle over nothing. There are 2 order forms, one from Motability. Another is the factory order form from the dealership. I signed one to oder a factory vehicle, and on that order was the owner, Motability sale, and the price was the AP. This order form is required to initiate the factory order. The vehicle was ordered by this form before my renewal window opened. Given the long wait times for factory orders, some dealers like to do it this way. As for a deposit requested by the dealer, it must be done in writing and signed by the customer. The deposit scheme must be ok with motability.
Well put. I’m amazed by some of the claims on here by “experts” I didn’t sign anything when I ordered my last car and , because of an AP drop, the dealer cancelled my Motobility order and re ordered without touching the internal sales order. If anyone cares to log onto their online account, press the leasing link and open the PDF, it shows that the owner of the car is Motobility Operations, we are the hirer from Motobility and the dealer is the supplier. If Motobility is the owner then we cannot enter into any legal agreement with a third party for a product we don’t own. The deposit is an agreement between you and the dealer to hold a reservation, similar to a restaurant table etc and if you cancel is subject to the understanding between the two of you. It does not prevent you from withdrawing. I think there is too much argument of principle and not reality.
Agreed! The only reference of “deposit” Motabililty makes, refers to the advance payment or part of, if the dealer requests this. The reason no one will ever have to pay a cancellation fee or loose their deposit, is because it would not be legally enforceable. At no stage do we ever enter into a legally binding contract with the dealer as we are not the “purchasers”. The only legally binding contract that we enter into, is with Motability Operations once we have entered the PIN on collection day. Dealers may try it on and withhold any depost (if you payed one) but will soon back down once challenged with legall action or small claims court. A dealer would have to prove in a court of law, that they have lost out financially, which would be very difficult indeed because (a) you are not the purchaser (b) They would be financially better off selling the car to a retail customer. The only time an enforeable contract is made between you and the dealer, is if you were to choose additional extra’s, such as factory fitted options, which do “not” form part of your agreement with Motability Operations and are treated seperately. If you are asked to pay a deposit upfront, other than for optional extras save yourself the hassle and place an order with a different dealer/group. For those who think I and others are wron’t, I recommend you get a free 3o minute consultation with a solicitor!
@kezo – I am not the purchaser on a vehicle I lease because I do not have the vehicle yet (essential in what I am saying) and the contract/order form is the dealership’s paperwork not MB’s paperwork.
What I did do was sign the paperwork as a purchaser of the ‘order’ for a vehicle I do not yet have, however once that order is then finalised by hand over of the car; be it lease by finance firms or MB then that transfers to them being the purchaser (MB)
If I sign something that states on the form ‘purchaser’ and my signature is next to it, it references me within the T&C’s when it states ‘purchaser’ whether or not I am the purchaser at the end of the process (when the car is handed over and the pin is put in) Because it is factual that I have signed my name next to that specific use of wording within that contract or “order agreement”.
To explain this way on how doing so actually benefitted me:
I signed the order document stating purchaser on my last vehicle , because I signed this order agreement and I ordered optional extras on a faulty vehicle, no where within that agreement (the same one that lists deposits being non refundable) did it state that my optional extras would also be non refundable should fault arise given CRA 2015 .
The contract or order agreement is not only for the purposes of the business/dealership but also for the customer too.
I relied upon that contract when I had a faulty vehicle. MB wouldn’t intervene in regards to the Optional extra payments (within their T&C’s), I relied solely upon that ‘contract’ where I signed as ‘purchaser’ the CRA 2015 a few piece’s of online forum ‘evidence’ to enable me to get my optional extra money back.
My argument of legal facts to get refunded for the optional extras went direct to VW compliance team in Germany and it was agreed that no separate contract was made in relation to the optional extras and I would be refunded but they didn’t agree to ‘any fault’ even though it was evidenced by words ‘faulty part’ on a video vehicle check by the dealership technician and I specifically used the CRA 2015, and the threatening of small claims court, I couldn’t be bothered with another court case as I was already in the midst of one and agreed to sign just to be done with it, it is after all what I was seeking.
I relied upon that specific document that I signed with the dealership when I placed the order that referred to me as the ‘purchaser’, because apparently the optional extra charges go direct to the manufacturer and the AP goes to MB, hence no involvement from MB in regards to optional extras as per their T&C’s.
It’s best for all MB customers to check especially, if your not comfortable handing money over you may loose or have to fight to get back, and always ask the question too.. what if I cancel my order what happens to my deposit?
Let’s face it the majority of MB customers are vulnerable in one aspect or another in life.
This forum should be to support each other not to say who’s right or wrong.
I run a business and have T&C’s for my customers which is specific to deposits.
Once they sign the document that T&C is enforceable so long as we as a business have complied with other regulations and laws that would allow the T&C to be enforceable such as those defined within the CRA 2015 (fit for purpose, as described, of satisfactory quality)
We are also considering the possibility that different dealerships/franchises will have different forms and different T&C’s.
Maybe it should just be specific to being a Motability order, to prevent them of ways they can get around taking money from people who are already vulnerable.
Don’t get me wrong; I have studied law, worked in retail and in a car dealership and then on for well known corporations in the UK to now running my own business.
I have successfully got my money back using said ‘contract’ for prior car from order with MB.
I have succeeded in every single claim I have ever made regarding refunds including the whirlpool tumble dryer farce where I actually had a washing machine and tumble dryer both faulty at the same time and I got current retail price refunded rather than the price I paid (£980 back for £450 worth of goods).
Honestly, I am known to get things ‘free’ and know how to get my money back! But it’s all about knowing what you are signing when you are signing it and using it to your advantage.
Should I wish to find a way to get my deposit back, believe me when I say it, yes I will, where there’s a will there’s a way!
From my experience and what I can evidence is that the document i’ve personally signed for MB orders through a dealerships is a dealership order agreement where I signed for the order to be processed on the system, my signature is next to the wording ‘purchasers signature’ the meaning of purchasers signature and the definition of that would be down to dealership to prove what is meant by it if not already defined within their T&C’s, but at the time of signing I would have reasonably known it formed a contract with me ‘purchaser’ to enable the dealership to place an order which then in turn meant the T&C’s that correspond to the document would define me therein as the ‘purchaser’ . Whether or not I purchase the vehicle in the end or the means of how the vehicle is purchased would not; at the time of the document being signed, be considered as it is not yet relevant, there is intent but the deal is not ‘done’ (until pin is put in and transferred to being both MB contract and dealership)
This includes where a deposit can be used for ‘consideration’ – a good, profit or service.
My personal business T&C’s state ‘customer’ but within the parameters of the T&C’s it states – Customer ‘you’ referenced by the persons name and address on the document and therein of the T&C’s ‘you’ refers to the customer whose name and address is on the document.
Knowledge is power and to know what your’e signing before you sign it is essential for everyone.
I mean other peoples orders on here may not have those T&C’s about deposits or their dealership might not take deposits, I think what matters is that people are aware if they are paying a deposit what it could mean if they cancel and being prepared for that.
Really there should be something in place to prevent this; because again our needs can change in an instant and mean we need to cancel an order and change vehicle, and I agree that its not fair for someone to loose their deposit, I would kick up a fuss to get deposit back even if I knew what I signed but that’s just me and some people simply don’t have the capacity, will power or strength.
Knowing what you are fighting before you fight it is key.
We fight a hard enough system as it is.
I have a child with SEND (non verbal/ SLCN, ASD,SPD,ADHD,ARFID) and know other parents of children with SEND and I help them out (successfully may I add) to get the help they need including things like DLA and PIP and Tribunals.
We simply must be prepared for battle, at all times.
My post isn’t intended to argue, it’s intended to inform of my experience and what is relevant to me.
As both a consumer and a business, when you sign your name to a ‘purchase’ ‘order’ ‘contract’ whether or not you are the intended ‘owner’ ‘purchaser’ ‘user’ you still have rights, but so does the business or person you sign the document to, again its about the battle!.