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It’s heartbreaking. We are at that point in the car’s economic journey where the end user is being squeezed. The industry is a shaken snow globe at the moment.
It’s heartbreaking. We are at that point in the car’s economic journey where the end user is being squeezed. The industry is a shaken snow globe at the moment.
I think only those manufacturers who don’t understand the market are shaken. And they are mainly from Europe. Apologies for using the word “woke”, but if you don’t understand the costs and is unable to predict the market, plus trying to push your agenda on the customers, it will cost. And will cost a lot.
But look at Tesla as an example. Yes, thanks to the same “woke” suddenly the guru of EVs became to be the Gargamel, and yet Elon Musk manages to reduce the price on his cars same time improving the quality as well as offering 0 APR… There are plenty of Chinese manufacturers. I agree their quality is not something to praise yet, but we should remember same was with Japanese cars after WW2 and South Korean electronics. They learn and do so very quickly.
But then the EU decided to purchase Russian gas indirectly (Google before you reply) and The energy costs went up outrageously.
But things are turning back to good: in the US they finally began “drill, baby, drill”. Some EU countries understand this woke approach will collapse their economies and I am hopeful in 2-3 years Tim, after a number of elections in the EU, the tide will change for Motability customers too. But for now we have no option, but squeeze the dealers: ask them for a discount and if they don’t oblige – go to another dealer.
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Apologies for briefness and spelling mistakes.Motability Skoda Enyaq SportLine 85x April 2024 (unhappy customer - Ombudsman pending)
Motability Mazda CX-60 July 2023 (unhappy customer - early termination on mechanical grounds)
Motability VW Touran Family Pack May 2019 (happy customer)You’ll own nothing and be happy.
A simple google search for WEF predictions and AI gives you this.
The World Economic Forum (WEF) has made several predictions about the future, particularly focusing on the year 2030. Key themes include significant technological advancements, shifts in global power, and changes in societal structures. Some specific predictions include the rise of AI, the potential decline of the US as a superpower, and a move towards more service-based economies.
Here’s a more detailed look at some of the WEF’s predictions:
Technology and the Future of Work:
AI and Automation:
The WEF anticipates significant growth in AI, robotics, and automation, which will reshape the job market. Some roles, like those in frontline industries (farmworkers, delivery drivers) and care jobs (nursing, teaching), are expected to see significant growth, while others, such as cashiers and administrative assistants, may decline.
Digital Access:
Broadening digital access is predicted to be a major transformative trend, with many employers expecting it to reshape their businesses.Skills Gap:
The WEF also highlights the need for upskilling and reskilling to prepare for the changing job market, with technology-related skills (AI, big data, cybersecurity) being in high demand.“You’ll Own Nothing, and You’ll Be Happy”:
This controversial prediction suggests a shift towards a service-based economy where people lease or subscribe to goods and services rather than owning them outright.
Geopolitical and Societal Changes:Shifting Global Power:
The WEF predicts a decline in US dominance and a sharing of power among other countries.Climate Change:
The WEF recognizes climate change as a major challenge, with potential for significant displacement of populations and economic losses.Social and Political Instability:
The WEF expects that increased global displacement and conflicts, coupled with the impacts of climate change, could push democracy to its limits.Space Exploration:
The WEF anticipates continued progress towards manned missions to Mars.
Other Predictions:
Health and Wellbeing: The WEF suggests that advancements in biotechnology could eliminate the need for organ donors and that personalized health monitoring will become more prevalent.Sustainability: The WEF emphasizes the need for sustainable food production, reducing plastic pollution, and protecting oceans.
Evolving Values: The WEF predicts a potential shift away from traditional Western values.
It’s important to note:
The WEF’s predictions are not set in stone and are subject to change based on evolving circumstances.
Some of the predictions, like “You’ll own nothing,” have been met with criticism and skepticism.
The WEF itself acknowledges that the future is uncertain and that many factors could influence its predictions.EX30 SMER Ultra
The decline in US dominance can’t come soon enough. It absolutely sickens me how world leaders of once proud countries (including our own Prime Minister) fawn over Trump and feed his childish ego at every twist and turn. I’ve always felt that the US is like a third world country, but with a lot of money, and the fact that their population hasn’t been able to generate a credible President since Obama is shocking.
as the title says why does the prices always go up so much
Back on topic, the prime reason why APs have been on a prolonged upward trajectory for some time has been Motability’s increasing exposure to the EV market and their crushing residual values, as private buyers don’t want them.
Some EVs, including expensive ones, can be worth as little as 20% of their new value after 3 years, whereas decent diesels (now very much in demand by savvy used buyers looking for long term ownership propositions) can exceed 60% retained values.
BTW, this isn’t me guessing. Motability have been telling their major dealer principals that EV residual values, and their increasing exposure to them, have been the main driver behind across the board AP increases and, sadly, they predict that this trend will continue.
Motability blame the residuals on EVs being so rubbish as the main cause for pushing up APs and yet they still push them very hard!
Motability blame the residuals on EVs being so rubbish as the main cause for pushing up APs and yet they still push them very hard!
Well, as Motability Operations walk a pretty thin tightrope in the triangle between Government and manufacturer targets, their owning banks and their defined customer base, what else can they do? Apart from becoming a ‘dumping ground’ for EV’s that retail buyers currently do not want.
Their latest 2025 Half Year results issued last month:
https://www.mo.co.uk/media/1swdkogg/half-year-report-2025.pdf
shows yet another pre-tax loss (on top of the full 2024 year losses) of -£144.6m for the half-year 2025 (with underlying losses accounting for -£75.3m of this).
Assuming the purchasing of vehicles is ‘as lean’ as it possibly can be whilst still maintaining customer choice (i.e. the leveraging of discounts from many manufacturers), it seems the losses must mount up at resale with poor residual values.
Yes, staff can be trimmed here and there, even their perks etc, but that is akin to tinkering around the edges within the overall financial structure.
However, one does wonder how long these losses can continue without a major structural reform of both Motability Operations and the scheme itself, unless such as AP’s rise consistently and considerably to help stem the ongoing losses.
I am sure many here can speculate where else Motability Operations can save money, but these losses are starting to become so well ingrained into the business, that one does wonder about its long term viabiliity.
Would extending the EV leases to 5 years smooth out the losses ?
Unfortunately I have suffered a brain injury and occasionally say the wrong thing.
Would extending the EV leases to 5 years smooth out the losses ?
It would certainly help Motability, but would be an appalling deal for the customer, unless they didn’t require the full surrender of benefits beyond year 3.
Would extending the EV leases to 5 years smooth out the losses ?
Beat me to it. Yet they are getting tougher on extending past 3 years. But then a car might be on 100k miles, instead of 60k 3 years. How many use the full allowance though. It’s clear though that the main losses are from cars they bought 3 years ago at inflated prices. They profited then, but didn’t see that the bubble would burst as many suggested it would. As it was born out of a lack of supply, coupled with higher costs for manufacturing and the needed microchips. Plus more competition from the east. Yes EV’s play a part as Technology moves on and leaves those older cars less desirable mainly Imo down to there slow charging time and speeds. What will happen when 800v are the norm, who will want 400v, unless that’s all they can afford. The average EV loses 1.8% range each year, which isn’t bad and is expected. So in 10 years 18% if looked after. Personally I’d never buy an EV at this moment in time any many are just leasing them. Those leasing companies are going to feel this also, as will many others effected by green policies. As for ice as there are less and less being sold each year and the next due to government levels. Used values will rise on them due to lack of availability and a higher demand for them than supply. There is a cost to climate change polices and that’s losing huge money on the transition being forced upon us all. how it all falls and plays out in the end who knows. Ultimately its us the consumer and tax payer who foots the bill.
EX30 SMER Ultra
Interesting subject.
EV residuals crashed after the parts shortage following Covid was resolved. Prior to this crash they were artificially high, some to the point where you could own the car for a year and still sell it for a profit. Then some idiots thought that was an advantage of EV ownership and were surprised when that stopped.
Secondly, there’s been a lot of communication around ownership of EVs from new, helped by corporate benefits and sales share targets. There’s not been much about ownership of EVs for those who would be the typical ex-fleet customer. Those who buy at 2-5 years old and change regularly having seen the worst of the depreciation already happen on the vehicle. These people will typically have a car that’s well within its HV warranty (battery, motor and associated parts), some within the warranty for the rest of the vehicle. However, those who talk to these potential customers all hear lots about failure and the excessive costs of replacement of the significant parts. (£20k battery anyone?)
There’s insufficient demand, hindered by a lot of BS around EVs from various sources. There’s genuine concern for reliability, not because the theory isn’t positive but because the data doesn’t exist in sufficient quantities around 5-7 year old versions of the current models. As technology evolves, older models are now of a historic technology. This doesn’t help persuade people to buy a used EV.
What’s surprising, though, is that in far too many cases the ownership of a used EV could be a wise choice. If charging at home is an option, the savings are phenomenal. Reliability of high voltage elements are still better than ICE, there’s simply mechanically less to go wrong. However, the rest of the vehicle are still equally as liable to fail as any other vehicle. That’s where there’s an issue, these Chinese manufacturers are untested over a prolonged period, nobody knows whether a Chinese built suspension will last, whether the steering could fail or whether the trim will fall off. So, currently, to buy a used Chinese EV which is likely to exceed 80,000 miles within this next period of ownership is effectively as much a pioneering venture as owning the original cars were. Not many used car buyers are of a pioneering mindset, they’re the ones who bought new.
Until all this has been resolved, residuals won’t recover to the usual levels. That means putting new EV manufacturers on the Scheme is a huge risk as either failure (mechanical or business) could become an issue and residual values in 3 years are utterly unknown, almost unpredictable. Even pricing known and popular models needs to include high depreciation despite the possibility that, in 3 years time, used EV retail may have taken off.
I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.Mark
Indeed, I know of some who from the huge savings they making on fuel each month by home charging it is paying for their car payments. Obviously they doing the miles to warrant that daily and is within the cars range. So no real added costs of public charging for most of there driving.
So far this month has been my most expensive month charging, since getting my Ev. So far I’ve used 245.85kwh (£16.50) / 12.3460kwh at a telsa ota £6.29 and 7.54kwh at an Instavolt £4.07 total cost £26.86.
Did a 280 mile round trip down to Harlow and back also. So since the beginning of feb, I’ve spent £93.73 on fuel. Have driven 2,372 miles, So just under 4p a mile that includes all public charging, preconditioning and using climate comfort in this heat as well as sometimes sitting in the car waiting for an hour or less, with the climate running.
Even if I got 400miles from my petrol mhev a full tank cost £60 (which sometimes I’d only get 200miles in winter, driving locally) I’d of spent at least £355.8O on fuel. So not bad and I guess if you drive more the saving would be huge. There no debating that. Guess those savings will help against my next AP in a 2028 or a deposit on a car off the scheme. The fact is each year we head closer to no new ice cars, so more and more EVs will be on the scheme as less an less ice are made and offered to the scheme. As I predict demand for the less and less made each year will be huge. My view has certainly changed as has my actual car usage and that suits an Ev more.
EX30 SMER Ultra
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