[Ricardohx4]

Hi guys

given PIP allowance went up last April, and again this April – how come we are not seeing cars falling into the price bands below our full allowance of what will be £300 a month now?

it’s too much money to lose on a new car for me now I think – so I’m looking at the less than allowance cars and wondering why there’s not quite a few more after the 10% increase last year?

Topic

[BigDave]

Ricardohx4 wrote:

Hi guys given PIP allowance went up last April, and again this April – how come we are not seeing cars falling into the price bands below our full allowance of what will be £300 a month now? it’s too much money to lose on a new car for me now I think – so I’m looking at the less than allowance cars and wondering why there’s not quite a few more after the 10% increase last year?

Basically due to the cost of vehicles and the scheme ancilleries (insurance, servicing, scheme running costs etc) all rising at an equivalent or even greater rate than the allowances used for the scheme.

 

[MickC]

I would like to see any increase in PIP passed onto the PIPEE after the lease agreement begins and not automatically diverted into Motability’s coffers.

[MFillingham]

MickC wrote:

I would like to see any increase in PIP passed onto the PIPEE after the lease agreement begins and not automatically diverted into Motability’s coffers.

 

You do realise that if you were to have the increases instead of Motability, they’d just recalculate the receipts over the 3 years and accordingly put up the APs?

They simply look at the price of the car, the expected receipt from the car at point of sale, the costs of insurance and servicing and then see what’s left for us to pay either in monthly (well, 4 weekly) or up front payments.  Allowing for 3% inflation increases, the total weekly payments turn out around £11,412, so, if the car needs a total of £15,000 income, we pay £3,600 AP.   If there was no inflationary increase, the weekly income at £71 per week is £11,076, so for the same car the AP would be somewhere between £3,900 and £4,000 depending upon how generous they’re feeling at the time.  The difference of £336 over 2 years really isn’t going to make a huge difference when split weekly or even 4 weekly.

I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

Mark

[Ricardohx4]

But if there was 10.1% increase April 2023 and now 6.7% April 2024…. How does it work if you’d got a car at let’s say 56.50 a week in late 2022 at which point mobility would have no clue of future increases, surely they don’t get 16.8% raised in 18 months on top of that 56.50? But if you were paying the full whack on a car, then I understand they do just “take” that 16.8% in essence?

sorry, I may be being thick having not delved into the scheme yet.

[mitch]

basically mota reduce the ap before reducing the monthly payment.

for example when i ordered my juke the ap was 631 and the weekly payment was £72. and it will stay at £72 all lease.

now the ap is £579 and the weekly pament is £79.25.

i get wpms by the way.

if your weekly payment is fixed at an amount below the current allowance it will be fixed for the term of the lease and you will receive any annual increases, if however it says total allowance then mota will get any increases in allowance as well.

[jOhn]

MACS (Mobility & Access Committee for Scotland – https://www.transport.gov.scot/our-approach/accessible-transport/mobility-and-access-committee-for-scotland-macs/) created quite a stink about the 10.1 increase last year.  They wrote to various bodies about it including Motability.   I asked for sight of the replies so I could see what reasons were given and have been fobbed off for months, the last one being that the Chair had to decide whether to release the replies.

If I don’t get a reasonable reply next week, I’ll put in a FOI request.

 

[MFillingham]

In normal circumstances you work on a 2-4% annual increase.  If you suddenly find that inflation hits something as monstrous as 10%, you’ll probably find your costs going up equally, so it won’t become all additional profit.

 

The simple answer is that we agree to pay the full amount regardless of what it is, if inflation is really high, then what they get goes up by lots but staff will expect pay rises, electricity and other property costs will also go up, we’ve seen what insurance has done over the last year or so, with some cars being very difficult and expensive to insure as parts are incredibly slow to appear.  If inflation is minimal, then cost increases are equally minimal.

For them, they have the main risk.  If the customer (who they don’t necessarily know) goes out and does 59,000 miles in 3 years, they have a slightly high mileage car to sell.  If the customer only does 2,000 a year, then they reap the benefits of an extremely low mileage car to sell.  Then there’s all the add ons that are paid for by the customer with no support from Motability, so you could have a top of the range car with a sound pack, comfort pack and family pack that cost you £3,000 over the AP.  When they sell that car, that will make it much more attractive and, therefore, valuable.

 

All that said, it’s a lease arrangement and we’re paying to use a car for 3-5 years (if extensions are allowable) with a guarantee of no residual value to us at the end.  However, we’re paying for the convenience of a car we, possibly, couldn’t afford otherwise and has a level of reliability (hopefully) that we wouldn’t get on the very used car we could afford.

 

If we’re worried about the cost and asset levels, then either the scheme isn’t for us or we’re worrying too much about things we can’t change.

I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

Mark

[Ricardohx4]

Ah ok Guys I get it, thanks – I can see why in Scotland they did that – I mean, I think I’d be gutted personally if I’d taken a car at the full allowance and not been able to get that 16.8% because that has quite literally gone straight to put my monthly gas & elec up to £150 a month.

i simply couldn’t have done it without the 16.8% as I put the direct debit up to £120 as soon as I got the 2023 increase (not till effing June and don’t get me started on that CON again) and I’ve promised Octopus I’ll up it to £150 this June…. That’s without using the gas ffs ??‍♂️

The difference perhaps is I’m single adult with rent way above the £350 a month housing element of my universal credit – as most people my age are stuck with that are new to this disability life gods dealt me last year, so the buck stops with me I won’t be buying a house now that’s a solid nope.
But obviously this is all helping me understand and it’d only be good for me on a £56 per week Kia if it runs on fresh air ?

hence my questions around lower prices vs inflation. I still think it kinda sucks for you guys that took it out pre April 2023 that are single people

• This reply was modified 1 year, 6 months ago by Ricardohx4.

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