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The Top Chap from Motability Operations gave a speech about how fantastic everything is.
- Now over 700 000 customers (this is a big jump, last quote was 670k and can remember it being 630k
- ‘Motability Operations has already moved more than 34,000 people into EVs and currently buys more than 7% of all new electric vehicles in the UK’
- Over our entire customer base, not just those in EVs, nearly half live on less than £20,000 a year, and only about half have off-street parking,”
- £300m had been set aside “to make EVs more affordable and accessible … spent close to half of this
- £13m of investment in installing more than 25,000 home chargers for customers.
- 33,000 wheelchair accessible vehicles (WAVs) – no electric design solution
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Very interesting and confirms what some of us have suspected, that in spite of not being an environmental organisation, priority is being given to EVs at the expense of other choices, in spite of the fact that currently less than 5% of Motability customers have so far chosen one, even though 50% of customers have off street parking. Statistics can work both ways!
wmcforum
Great to see a truly good news story for a change. By prioritising EVs they are of course acting in everyone’s best interest both in cutting pollution and easing greenhouse gases. I don’t want to create a them and us situation and I do hope there will be an adequate choice of ICE vehicles.
Keep up the great work Motability!
By prioritising EVs they are of course acting in everyone’s best interest both in cutting pollution and easing greenhouse gases
I am yet to be convinced by that, especially when their manufacture create’s more pollution and greenhouse gasses mking them have a much higher carbon footprint than an equivulent ICE car. Given the majority of scheme users are low mileage drivers many EV’s won’t offset the higher manufacturing pollution during their 3yr lease. But perhaps we should not worry about that as we don’t see the destruction of villages and homes and the terrible working conditions and health conditions of those in countries that are out of sight out of mind!
Even here in the UK electricity isn’t 100% green, nor should we forget the red diesel powered heavy machinery laying our EV infrastructure or the diesel generators powering charger points where infrastructure hasn’t been laid perhaps because of objection to pylons or by landowners. Nor should we forget the mad hatter of London ULEZ that adds 13 minutes to ones life.
I should imagine the real reason of the majority choosing electric cars are perhaps doing it for cheaper running cost, for which I can’t blame them,
I’m a great believer the scheme should have a balanced choice of vehicles, not favouring one power over the other. Equally the scheme should not become a scape goat for manufacturers so they can meet the governments EV sales targets starting from next year!
All very good points @kezo. Anyone getting an EV should do so because it’s their preference given a free choice and presumably because it saves them money in the long run. I believe that it takes something like 80,000 miles before the extra environmental damage caused by the manufacture of an EV begins to turn into a net positive – a mileage which no Motability customer will ever reach!
I have no problem with an improved choice of EVs, but the APs should reflect their leasing costs. Having £300m earmarked to make them more affordable means that the APs of other vehicle types are effectively subsidising them. I’m a great believer in supply and demand in a free market. Subsidies often result in profiteering. It’s happened with house builders (with Help to Buy schemes) as well as car manufacturers. When the government subsidies were cut, manufacturers cut their prices. If manufacturers know that Motability are subsidising APs they will have far less incentive to reduce them.
Kezo
I don’t think you will ever be convinced as you don’t want to believe it. EVs aren’t perfect by a long way but they are infinitely less harmful to the environment than fossil fuel cars and even “Big Oil” has said as much.
I don’t believe that EVs are being subsidised indeed the government has subsidised the fossil fuel industry by £20 billion more than Renewable energy since 2015.
I think Motability have taken the right approach in embracing the new technology whilst maintaining a stock of ICE vehicles as well. Until recently we only had a small stock of EVs but the balance is shifting. Having said that perhaps some more premium ICE cars (as they’ve done with EVs) wouldn’t go amiss.I don’t think you will ever be convinced as you don’t want to believe it. EVs aren’t perfect by a long way but they are infinitely less harmful to the environment than fossil fuel cars and even “Big Oil” has said as much.
Its not a matter of being convined, its the Carbon offsetting I’m not covinced and strongly disagree with but, the gullible will just see this as the best thing since sliced bread.
Having an EV (if one can afford) because they believe one would be cheaper for them run over time I can except and totally agree with but, having one on the presumption that one thinks they are better for the enviroment, whils’t failing to understanding where materials come from and by planting a tree or a setting up windmill as a means of offsetting, then no I’m not convinced.
Apart from the likes of the Guardian, where have “big oil” ever said this?
The other thing to think about which is quite complicated is the different charging rates prices etc I found this Guy very good at explaining it but it’s still very complicated and for some one with philosophical disabilities also very challenging but I’m sure Motability think about that as a primary concern anyway enjoy the video link
The more I think about the figures quoted by Motability, the more questions it poses.
If almost half of Motability customers survive on less than £20k a year, I wonder what proportion of Motability customers are able to afford the very high APs that are now being asked for decent sized cars?
I’m also surprised that so many people on that sort of income can afford to sacrifice over £11k of that income every 3 years (plus AP etc) on a car. That’s a huge proportion of their income.
Philosophical should read pre existing
I should have proof read it first before posting
At Glos guy, totally agree annual income to Ap don’t align.
The more I think about the figures quoted by Motability, the more questions it poses. If almost half of Motability customers survive on less than £20k a year, I wonder what proportion of Motability customers are able to afford the very high APs that are now being asked for decent sized cars? I’m also surprised that so many people on that sort of income can afford to sacrifice over £11k of that income every 3 years (plus AP etc) on a car. That’s a huge proportion of their income.
I can only assume its the weekly payment, rather than the full 3 year outlay thats taken into account by some users?
I paid 2700 AP for a 190bhp tiguan 4wd sunroof etc in 2019… Now you got 1.2 litre 7 seater SUV’s going for 4k AP – Dont get it at all.
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Philosophical should read pre existing I should have proof read it first before posting
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I quite like the original to be honest! Thankfully they don’t award PIP for that though otherwise the whole country would be on it ?"Come on BYD Seal!"If you are a non working person on pip and you don’t or cannot have a home charger it is astronomical charging your ev on the public charging system today I charged up my Renault Megan iconic at a pulse 150kw charger from 16%-90% this gave me 210 miles at a cost £39.11 what a complete joke.
Debate is healthy of course, but in all the discussion about lack of choice & unrealistic AP’s, it seems that we are forgetting that the Motability scheme is a fantastic route for the disabled, to contract hire a reliable vehicle ( or mobility scooter) very often ( still) at a low or even no advanced payment, in order for the ‘disabled person’ to become/ remain mobile, and very importantly ‘without credit checks or Income assessment ‘etc. which allows many of us to have much better cars than most of us would otherwise get, and Motability is a godsend to many disabled people!
@Mike 700
Couldn’t agree with you more. We are so lucky to have this scheme as apart from the benefits of a company car nothing else really compares.
I agree we could do with lower ap’s and larger, quality ICE models but overall it really is the only way for the disabled to get a decent car.
Someone showed a excerpt from the NHS scheme but the figures shown only applied to higher rate taxpayers, and even then Motability was more than competitive.
As you rightly say Mike everyone will see the scheme from their own perspective but we do need to be grateful for what we have.
Richard you have confirmed what I thought and currently putting me off an EV unless you have a drive and a home charger then you are thrown to the dogs Unless Tesla comes onto the scheme we live in hope
Please have a look at this video will give you the best info out there at the moment
@Mike 700
Agree with you 100%. Apart from the best Company car schemes Motability is second to none. APs could be lower and we could do with more large, quality ICE cars. But I still say we get a lot for our money. Someone showed prices from the NHS Scheme but to get those prices you have to be earning £50,000pa and thus pay higher rate tax. Even then Motability is very competitive.
As you say Mike, Motability is indeed a godsend to disabled people and their carers.
There’s still far more choice getting an Ice vehicle than EV. Want a large vehicle at a reasonable AP no EV for you. Nearly all the affordable EVs have a relatively tiny boot certainly no good for wheelchair or scooter users.
Fact is the EVs are subsidised for all we know like councils and housing associations MB might be getting extra grants to help push electric. Fact is for the vast majority electric is cheaper to run and subsidising people into those cars helps with fuel poverty and social mobility. Even after electricity price rises it’s still cheaper than fuel if you can charge at home.
There’s still an order of magnitude more non electric cars on the scheme for cheaper than the decent sized EVs.
So what if MB want to encourage electric take up fact is without MB nearly every EV driver on the scheme wouldn’t have an ev that’s huge.
My first car on the scheme is a ZS EV and next year my next car will be another EV electric had given me my freedom back versus the outrageous cost of fuel plus my hands no longer hurt from engine vibration and I can refuel at home overnight whereas more often than not the local petrol stations have run out again due to tourists.
Horses for courses until 2035 but if motability wants to help subsidise ap on EVs then good I say they should do similar for automatics too as that cost is outrageous too
@Mike 700 Agree with you 100%. Apart from the best Company car schemes Motability is second to none. APs could be lower and we could do with more large, quality ICE cars. But I still say we get a lot for our money. Someone showed prices from the NHS Scheme but to get those prices you have to be earning £50,000pa and thus pay higher rate tax. Even then Motability is very competitive. As you say Mike, Motability is indeed a godsend to disabled people and their carers.
Thank you Daf,
I realise that this Forum, just like Motability, caters for all – rich & poor, large & small, young & old etc.However, having spent many years in banking, as a lending mandate holder, i do know that Lenders providing loans , leases etc would not , even could not , look favourably at some applications necessary to buy/ lease/ contract hire some of the vehicles offered by Motability .
Motability, however, can allow people with lower incomes to undertake substantial contracts, for vehicles necessary to accommodate their disability, or indeed, because they just fancy a particular car because they ( Motability) have certainty of payment via the Government , ie no risk lending , and long may this live!
I do not blame anyone for wishing better cars were available, we all would like to get the best for our buck, it’s the nature of the beast ,but I believe that we would leave ourselves wide open to attack , and indeed jealousy, by scurrilous journalists and politicians ,& who knows where that would lead, if we widen the choice too much?
I see like most of the threads on here this has turned into one saying we should all be grateful to Motability despite the enormous profits they generate and the over average wages and benefits they pay to their employees.
I’m not grateful to them one bit. I see a Motability lease as a business transaction that either suits me or not depending on what is on the scheme at what cost. I do however accept that for some people it is their only way of getting a new vehicle at a price they can afford. I’m not in that bracket and I’m thankful for it.
Fantastic post wmcforum, good to see MB going from strength to strength. And doing their bit for removeing the pollution. Its for our kids and grandkids that can breathe clean air. Nevermind the crying oldies, you would think they would want rhe bestes for there kids.
Fantastic post wmcforum, good to see MB going from strength to strength. And doing their bit for removeing the pollution. Its for our kids and grandkids that can breathe clean air. Nevermind the crying oldies, you would think they would want rhe bestes for there kids.
Sigh! But whatabout the communities being lost from Lithium mining or the chidren that work down Lithium mines In Asian countries e…., just so are kides and granchildren can breath clean air. Not as EV’s are green during manufacture as they have a higher footprint, which many on the scheme won’t cover enough miles to offset this!
I see like most of the threads on here this has turned into one saying we should all be grateful to Motability despite the enormous profits they generate and the over average wages and benefits they pay to their employees. I’m not grateful to them one bit. I see a Motability lease as a business transaction that either suits me or not depending on what is on the scheme at what cost. I do however accept that for some people it is their only way of getting a new vehicle at a price they can afford. I’m not in that bracket and I’m thankful for it.
I think that we have already established that the Motability scheme is a godsend for many disabled people, but clearly there still lingers the argument that MO profits & salaries are excessive.
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Nobody would support excessive profits. Any well run efficient business however will make a profit on its operation and in the case of Motability these profits are reinvested in the business ie held in reserve to safeguard the business and to have ready funds available to grow the business and are not distributed to shareholders! The actual annual profit is not excessive..The National Audit Office report on Motability says-
“The Motability scheme delivers an excellent service to its customers, earning remarkable satisfaction levels. Motability Operations’ management deserves credit for having turned the business around and investing in features that have enhanced benefits for customers. ”
No one supports unjustified salaries, but to attract the right calibre of staff, salaries must be competitive
MO have offices in London, Edinburgh and Bristol ,the first two being the epicentres of business/commerce Etc., and the third being geographically placed to deal with the West Country and Wales.
According to Reed employment, in 2021, the average UK salary for a Customer Service operative is £22,003 , with a low of £20400 and a high of £24500, and for a call centre operative it is some £25500 with the ability to earn into the late £30,000’s.
The salaries paid by Motability Operations as reported are an average of £24640 which includes any bonuses , for Customer Services and £25408 in a Call centre.
It seems to me, that these incomes , albeit towards the top end of the scale, are not excessive, especially as they are averages which include working in London and Edinburgh.OK
I see like most of the threads on here this has turned into one saying we should all be grateful to Motability despite the enormous profits they generate and the over average wages and benefits they pay to their employees. I’m not grateful to them one bit. I see a Motability lease as a business transaction that either suits me or not depending on what is on the scheme at what cost. I do however accept that for some people it is their only way of getting a new vehicle at a price they can afford. I’m not in that bracket and I’m thankful for it.
I think that we have already established that the Motability scheme is a godsend for many disabled people, but clearly there still lingers the argument that MO profits & salaries are excessive. . Nobody would support excessive profits. Any well run efficient business however will make a profit on its operation and in the case of Motability these profits are reinvested in the business ie held in reserve to safeguard the business and to have ready funds available to grow the business and are not distributed to shareholders! The actual annual profit is not excessive.. The National Audit Office report on Motability says- “The Motability scheme delivers an excellent service to its customers, earning remarkable satisfaction levels. Motability Operations’ management deserves credit for having turned the business around and investing in features that have enhanced benefits for customers. ” No one supports unjustified salaries, but to attract the right calibre of staff, salaries must be competitive MO have offices in London, Edinburgh and Bristol ,the first two being the epicentres of business/commerce Etc., and the third being geographically placed to deal with the West Country and Wales. According to Reed employment, in 2021, the average UK salary for a Customer Service operative is £22,003 , with a low of £20400 and a high of £24500, and for a call centre operative it is some £25500 with the ability to earn into the late £30,000’s. The salaries paid by Motability Operations as reported are an average of £24640 which includes any bonuses , for Customer Services and £25408 in a Call centre. It seems to me, that these incomes , albeit towards the top end of the scale, are not excessive, especially as they are averages which include working in London and Edinburgh.OK
Blimey. Where to start with that lot Mike! The NAO report was a complete whitewash. Other investigations, such as the one done for the parliamentary review, were far more probing and exposed the real picture, such as the fact that each lease is overpriced by several hundred pounds. To take some of the other points that you raise though;
Most call centre staff have very tough sales targets to hit for products or services. Motability Operations staff don’t, yet their basic salaries are top end and they also receive very generous bonuses against very soft (non sales) targets.
Even the most junior staff at Motability Operations have a gold plated benefits package, the like of which is virtually non-existent anywhere these days, let alone call centres. The fact that this is paid for by the surrendered benefits of disabled people is IMHO shameful.
Satisfaction levels will always be high amongst those who use the scheme, as the metrics are soft and many customers seem to think that Motability are doing them a great favour and don’t really understand the true cost of running a Motability car. The far more important service measures would be establishing why twice as many people who are eligible to join the scheme choose not to. For every eligible person who feels that Motability is a great option for them, two don’t!
Without an ounce of consultation with those who fund the scheme (i.e. us) Motability now donate millions to other charities. I would rather see that money put to reducing APs. Any Motability customer wishing to donate to other charities is free to do so.
I could go on, but you get my drift. The concept of Motability is fantastic and I completely understand that for many it offers a lifeline and may be their only route to running a new car. However, IMHO its monopoly position and lack of robust scrutiny has allowed it to drift massively from its core purpose and with no competition and full VAT exemption they could be offering far more choice at far better prices.
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