Under 25's being squeezed out

This topic contains 86 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by Avatar Samuel 1 week ago.

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  • #55240 Reply
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    wmcforum
    Which Mobility Car

    The criteria for under 25’s is the vehicle (excluding some vans) must be insurance group 16 of less and brake horse power of 120 or less.

    It’s been brought to our attention that new cars are having their insurance group raised, with the increase in safety equipment, autonomous braking etc and security we are at a little loss as to how these are calculated, we understand that Thatcham https://www.thatcham.org/ grade the cars from 1-50 but how can an old A Class Merc 180d SE be group 13 and the new car insurance group 20 and the old Ford Focus 1.5 diesel be two points lower than the new one?

    In fairness to Motability the new Focus 1.5 diesel Zetec is 17 with Thatcham but they have reduced it to 16 so under 25’s can get it which is obviously a good thing.

     

     

Viewing 25 replies - 1 through 25 (of 86 total)
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  • #55258 Reply
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    fwippers
    Participant

    I think Motability need to look at this issue. BHP is a strange measuring tool as it’s the cars torque (generally) which determines it’s acceleration. A 5bhp increase would include a few more cars.

    #57753 Reply
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    Marco

    I think its about time they increased the insurance group and BHP limit or introduce something like a insurance contribution to help the scheme as its getting a bit out of hand with all these new cars that were previously being driven by under 25’s being taken off due to these restrictions. Motability is a scheme for all ages and there are many disabled youngsters who drive cars and want to drive nice cars. Cars are getting safer by the day, many with new autonomous modes etc. I just don’t understand, it looks to be aimed at just the elders at the moment. Baffling stuff

    #57754 Reply
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    Wigwam
    Participant

    Does this not reflect the real world of car insurance outside of Motability?   Young drivers usually have to start with small low insurance group cars and build up a no-claim history before being able to drive anything considered sporty. Yes cars are safer for the occupants but they can still do considerable damage to property and kill people if badly driven.

    #57755 Reply
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    Wigwam
    Participant

    Surely, performance is power to weight ratio – small car, big engine etc.

    #57758 Reply
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    Trev
    Moderator

    This restriction on choice of vehicle is purely down to the insurance element of the lease, so perhaps the solution is to raise the excess for under 25’s to £500 in exchange for a higher insurance group bracket of say 20?

    It would be interesting to have some views from our under 25 audience on their take on this subject.


    Mota History - Nissan Qashqai Ford Focus Seat Leon ST Mazda CX-5

    #57760 Reply
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    mitch

    lets face it under 25s outside the scheme are not able to afford insurnce on anything considered sporty the insurance premiums are horrendous and many end up with 3rd party rather than fully comp. how many under 25s outside the scheme can afford a brand new car. i think a little realism is called for here.

    #57761 Reply
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    Matt

    Just for the sake of balance – how many under 25’s are handing over £239 every 4 weeks? It’s not an insignificant amount considering the limitations in place.

    #57764 Reply
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    fwipperie

    The Karoq at £795 for a 1.6tdi sel looks a good bet, and the superb for those needing something bigger £1845 for the se model. Agree insurance rates for under 25s horrendous, perhaps Motability need a 2 tier system unless that’s considered discriminatory?

    #57765 Reply
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    fwipperie

    Many under 25’s are “handing over £239 every 4 weeks” just for insurance on an “old banger”. To pay the same for a brand new car (plusAP) is possibly fantastic value for many and allows them a car which would otherwise be unaffordable.

    #57769 Reply
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    Robert

    There is an alternative for younger drivers if they wish to use their money outside the scheme. My daughter has just bought a car through Marmalade she has got her first years insurance included. However, my other daughter couldn’t get free insurance but got a huge discount and is only paying £530 for her first year. They offer a good range of cars basically on a PCP deal with no deposit. The insurance deals vary car to car and model to model, the insurance is also very postcode dependant. It’s worth a look for anyone with a youngster who has just passed their test. Search for marmalade cars and I’m sure you’ll find it.

    #57770 Reply
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    Matt

    I think you might be over estimating the insurance costs to under 25’s. Even in my first year the insurance was under £1700, 2nd year dropped, 3rd year again. I was driving and old banger at £1000 value. Tax was £120 a year. Keep in mind that’s an age of 20 for some with 3 years no claims and reasonable insurance costs, then 5 years of £239 every 4 weeks for a far more limited number of vehicles…. It does seem a little too restricted. As Trev says above, a higher excess could resolve the issue very easily.

    #57771 Reply
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    fwipperie

    In some London postcodes £4k upwards for teenagers, postcode affects greatly.

    #57772 Reply
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    Mo

    I’m under 25 and I’d happily be willing to give a contribution towards the insurance or settle for a higher excess in order to drive a better car. I’m not talking about the biggest of engines but something that’s a little more than 120bhp and/or with an insurance group of 16+

    #57773 Reply
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    Matt

    Couldn’t agree more, although London is a very small sample area in comparison to the average across the UK.

    #57774 Reply
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    gilders
    Participant

    Drivers aged 16-20 already have a £500 excess. Are you saying that the age group 21-25 should have an excess increase so that the highest risk group (16-20’s) can get access to higher insurance cars at no extra charge? Obviously the 21-25s get access to higher insurance groups in this scenario, but as some of these 21-25’s could have already have up to 8 years no claim bonus it seems a bit unfair.

    The follow are average insurance prices (for Leeds/Sheffield area) based on age (note that these prices are from Q2 2018 and are between 13-15% LESS than last year)

    17-20 £2,723

    21-25 £1,758

    26-30 £1,192

    Averages continue to drop until the 61-65 age bracket at £555

    The above figures don’t consider what the average insurance group is for the various age bands. But it is highly likely, due to the high costs of insurance in the 17-20 bracket, that the average young driver is driving a lower insurance group than the other age bands. Therefore I don’t think Motability could give access to higher insurance group vehicles to 16-20 year olds without increasing AP.

    #57775 Reply
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    AlanA

    Simple. You try and get a decent quote for insurance on an over 25 car and see how much it is.

     

    #57776 Reply
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    gilders
    Participant

    One solution – Any under 25’s (especially 16-20) who want a vehicle above 120bhp/insurance group 16 have the option of taking out their own insurance (or pay a “high risk” premium direct to Motability/RSA). If the only SUITABLE (i.e. not just what the customer likes the look of) vehicle is higher than 120BHP/insurance group 16, then they should be able to apply for a grant (for the “high risk” insurance premium)explaining why none of the insurance inclusive vehicles are suitable.

    I strongly believe that disabled drivers shouldn’t be redistricted in what is available, but just as I’d expect to pay a higher AP for more expensive cars, I’d expect to pay more for the insurance if I was considered high risk.

    #57783 Reply
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    callmejohn

    To put the under 25s restrictions into perspective, 25s and over have also had restrictions put in place this year, as they can no longer get a (non hybrid) car over 200bhp, which could rule out a suitable car, as we do not decide which engine goes into which car with which often needed trim.

    Let’s face it if any of us, wish to be a “boy racer” (regardless of age or gender), we could go far too fast in any car on the motability list, once up to speed.

    #58046 Reply
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    Adam

    Do Motability read this forum or does someone need to put ‘gliders’ suggestion ahead? I personally think that’s a very fair solution.

    #58058 Reply
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    mitch

    the basic thing is could an under 25 get a brand new car insured fully comp for the cost of motability outside of the scheme? i bet the restriction on choice would be huge i doubt there would be anything on the list that would be anywhere near classed as sporty. i feel at times theres a bit of an attitude of entitlement at play, i want therefore i should get.

    i for one even though i am over 25 (well over) would struggle to afford a brand new car every 3 years but for the scheme. whilst restrictions can be frustrating particularly if they impact the disability the fact that your restricted on the engine size is hardly the end of the world.

    #58065 Reply
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    Wigwam
    Participant

    Agreed.

    I would like to understand a situation where someone is unable to get what they need from the scheme, rather than unable to get what they want.

    Life’s a compromise, on a daily basis!

    #72058 Reply
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    Kieren

    I find it unfair about it has to be 120bhp or below and insurance group 16 or below as most new cars start at 130 bhp and if your like me I am 22 and I need 3 normal size seats in the back as I need to put three car seats in the back.

    And a motability is a lot cheaper a month than just getting a brand new car as you only pay for fuel and if you get a brand new car on hp you would be looking at round £400 or more plus insurance. insurance on a big car for me is only £80 a month so all together about £500 not included servicing or tyres so I would love to get a Peugeot 5008 or something like that on motability as it works out a lot cheaper for me

    #72077 Reply
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    Stewart

    I’ve been in touch twice now with Motability regarding my son and both times got the same reply that it’s not on the agenda at the moment.

    The problem is that every time a new model comes out, the insurance group goes up. Eventually there won’t be any cars on there for under 25’s if the rules stay the same.

    He has just ordered an Audi Q2 black edition which makes a mockery of the system as it’s insurance group is lower than most cars with exactly the same engine including the A1.

    As far as being young and having to work his way up, he has been driving since the age of 16 and has had no accidents and no points. Something that many older drivers would be envious of.

    #77103 Reply
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    Fergal

    I was wondering if you are willing to pay extra for your car to cover the insurance would motability allow this as I’ve been driving motability cars since 17 and I’m now 23with no claims or points

    As I’m due to change shortly but any of the cars I want I’m not fit to get and some of the cars I would like come with electric seats and this would help my greatly and I’m disabled and have to drive with hand controls

    #77121 Reply
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    Philjb

    It all comes down to the risk the brokers are prepared to take on.

    If we had all the facts and figures on all under 25 drivers on the scheme we would be better off to judge.

    Im lucky I don’t have any children under 25 so the rules don’t apply to me.

    Although in my case they drive what suits me not the other way round.

    In my eyes I think the system is pretty fair, all drivers start on small engined or insurance group cars, all mine did?

     

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