January 30, 2018 at 12:47 am #39786
I’ve put the title of this thread in capitals because that is how important this is.
The Court has decided that the government behaved illegally with PIP in regard to people with mental health problems.
There is a stigma attached to mental health and none of us likes to admit that we struggle with issues, but the fact is we do. That includes a large number of us for whom the anxiety and stress caused by just living at home on a day to day basis, and trying to cope with daily tasks (that able bodied people may easily take in their stride). Going out and making even simple journeys while dealing with our disabilities can raise stress and anxiety levels through the roof, especially if you have to use public transport.
As a result of the judgement 1.6 million cases will now be reviewed with 220,000 claimants expected to have their claims increased.
When we answered the questions on the PIP form, how embarrassing was it to say we cannot do this and we cannot do that. Do we not now think that the government department responsible for the whole mess counted on our inability to be totally objective with such an emotive issue?
The courts have acknowledged that vulnerable disabled people were taken advantage of by the mindless bureaucracy that intimidated us at every turn.
The government has immediately accepted the Judges decision and say that they will not appeal it.
January 30, 2018 at 1:44 am #39788
Really good news and thanks for posting it. I agree so much more help is needed to mental health issues and the people that go through it on a daily basis. They seem.to be pushed to 1 side and forgotten about. All of us can suffer at anytime with this and people really need to understand that it is never obvious what is right in front of us. The way dwp have done the tests in the past is a joke even my wife who is blind and has all the paperwork was sent for one and upon arriving was told no need for you to be here I don’t know why they told you to come really nice man to be honest but we was lucky so many others are treated unfairly and with life changing results as I’m sure we all know many people just give up. We all need to pull together and stay strong and help where we can. Together we are much much stronger and no more should someone feel they are alone.January 30, 2018 at 1:45 am #39789
until mental health is no longer frowned upon and no longer a stigma we will all remain experts at hiding it or ignoring it, sufferers and non sufferers alike.
This can only be a step in the right direction!January 30, 2018 at 7:36 am #39799
I am grateful to Pops for starting this thread and for the very articulate explanation of the issues faced by those with mental health issues. I must confess (and please don’t shoot me down, I’m just being honest) that I have never really understood why somebody with, for example, confidence issues leaving the house, warrants a level of benefit that ultimately provides them with a Motability car, on the basis that I can’t see why having a car provided by Motability suddenly overcomes issues that cannot be addressed with a car of their own. The explanation provided in the first post does help me understand why this might help, for example, if the persons issues are with using public transport and they don’t own a car and can’t work to pay for one.
As a tax payer, I do feel that the benefits system needed overhauling as it is well known that it has been subject to enormous levels of fraud which we all end up paying for. It is also well known that the Motability scheme has been subject to substantial fraud. I guess that, historically, it had been easier for people to over exaggerate the impact of mental health issues than it has been for those suffering from measurable physical disabilities and it became an obvious area to target. The end result, of course, has been that those with genuine and severe mental health issues that may well be debilitating have suffered.
However, whilst I have some sympathy with the need to overhaul the benefits system, the whole PIP process has been appalling, in my opinion. My wife’s disability is physical rather than mental, yet she found the application process overwhelming. I completed all the forms for her and it took me a week to do it properly. I can quite believe that many people would have taken one look at it and just given up. My wife has a serious, progressive, degenerative condition, for which there is no cure. She now has to use a wheelchair and cannot stand unaided. Her condition will only worsen, yet her PIP entitlement suggested that the next review would be in 2-3 years time. I submitted a Mandatory Reconsideration (or whatever it’s called) challenging the need for her to be subjected to it all again so soon and asking what medical evidence they were relying on that suggested that her condition might have improved by then, given the fact that there is no cure. Within a few weeks the decision was overturned and her earliest possible review date is now in 10 years time. All of this was a considerable amount of work for me and relied upon me doing a lot of research to know how to phrase things and the grounds to challenge. I can completely understand how someone with mental health issues would not be able to do this and would therefore suffer as a result. That’s just not right.
On the basis that 1.6 million cases are going to be reviewed, it must mean that ALL PIP cases are going to be gone over again, not just those relying on mental health issues. What a debacle. Countless stress (again) for all concerned and the biggest winners will be the companies doing the assessments. I just hope that those in genuine need are taken care of and that our economy is robust enough to take the £4bn hit, on top of everything else currently being thrown at it.January 30, 2018 at 7:43 am #39801
Totally, totally, agree with everything you said here. Well written Glos GuyJanuary 30, 2018 at 9:42 am #39813
On the flip side, and more to the point, should people with mental health issues be permitted to drive cars?. In the event they are involved in an accident l would imagine there would be all kinds of legal arguments; an absolute minefield. In particular, from the insurance perspective.
Would not wish the condition on anyone, but if a family member was involved in such an incident, the responsibility would hang heavily in one direction, even before the lawyers got involved. Simply human nature to react that way
The ultimate aim is for everyone to be safe on the road. Too many people are killed by drink or drugs on the road, the last thing we need is for additional elements to be added to the mix.January 30, 2018 at 10:23 am #39820
Motability is not limited to the driver of the car gasman00 do you think that someone who is blind drives there motability car, and in your opinion if someone uses car driving adaptions are they also part of your ” additional elements to be added to the mix” of people who shouldn’t be “permitted to drive cars”?
Your views are to pardon the pun very short sighted.January 30, 2018 at 10:25 am #39821
An excellent post. Nowadays we need to be so aware of legalities, rights and how to correctly phrase things. I have just concluded a three year battle with a large company which culminated in court action and success. The downside; about 200+ hours of my time and a lot of stress, plus lots of letter writing and gathering evidence. Many would have given up. It is typical of the 21st century, you need to fight for everything.January 30, 2018 at 10:28 am #39822
Unfortunately due to my head injury I cannot fully understand/read your post, however from my limited opinion I agree with you, I see what you see but don’t know how to say it, yes your are 100% right, fortunately I had help to fill in my form so was rewarded 24 for car and 24 for mobility.
Prior to my accident I had a BS.c and Master Degree and writing this now is a struggle without help.
Over the years and even today we could all tell incident of fraud.January 30, 2018 at 10:39 am #39823
You are one of the mindless muppets we are up against, my Neurosurgeons, My Doctors etc. after in depth tests say I am safe to drive.
Have you been checked for epilepsy or your special awareness or reactions ? If not you may be more of a risk than us.
Just because you have mental health just mean you need just a little more help and understanding.January 30, 2018 at 11:15 am #39826
Complete different question I’ve never asked for pip but I have chronic back pain the mussels in my lower back are mush im now on a waiting list for reactive devise to be inserted to my spine and batterie to to put under the skin of my upper butt😆.i care for my hubby and my back has just got worse.Do I have a right to pip🤔January 30, 2018 at 11:22 am #39828
It’s not so much what’s wrong with you, it’s more about how it affects your daily living, all I can suggest is if you think it affects your daily living, apply, the worst they can say is ‘no’.January 30, 2018 at 11:29 am #39829
It affects me daily I can’t walk far I sit to chop up food kids help with hoovering and dishes. I use bath lift and stoel. Never thought of it befor as I care for my partner.but been to specialist last week and someone mentioned it to me I said don’t be daft.January 30, 2018 at 11:43 am #39831
I should not have called you a mindless muppet it was wrong, Over the years I have seen people with mental health problems treated very badly. I once witness a man kick a girl with downs syndrome in the back because she would not move out the way, I humiliated him in front of everyone.
People with mental health problem just need a bit or care and understanding, the mind is very complicated, one of our uncles and a friend have Alzheimer.January 30, 2018 at 12:03 pm #39835
Hi Jane.. I was like you and never considered DLA/PIP as that was for “Disabled people” It wasn’t till I had my first spine surgery that a hospital spine recovery nurse sat me down and explained that I had a disability… I was brought up like most to believe that disability was only when you had a wheelchair or had an obvious physical health issue, I was so wrong…
I spent my days like a prisoner, popping opioid medications, sleeping tabs, muscle relaxants etc just to get through my day, in constant pain knowing that it would never get better and praying it would never get worse, so when the spinal nurse and hospital consultant sat me down and told me I have a disability it actually took me a little time to see what they meant but the difference it made to my life was startling, I researched my health issues, joined forums and support groups and sort the help I needed and I can honestly say that out of all of it the motability scheme has been the greatest of all, freedom to go where I need to when I want to and to also return when I have to, the ability to help with daily activities like doing my own shopping etc… I could go on…. If you looked at me you would have no idea of the daily struggle I go through but trust me it’s there and I am aware that it will never improve and that is why I think the change of view towards long term mental health issues is a welcome change for all those out there that suffer and don’t have an immediately obvious disability……January 30, 2018 at 12:09 pm #39838
Hi Jane.. I was like you and never considered DLA/PIP as that was for “Disabled people” It wasn’t till I had my first spine surgery that a hospital spine recovery nurse sat me down and explained that I had a disability… I was brought up like most to believe that disability was only when you had a wheelchair or had an obvious physical health issue, I was so wrong… I spent my days like a prisoner, popping opioid medications, sleeping tabs, muscle relaxants etc just to get through my day, in constant pain knowing that it would never get better and praying it would never get worse, so when the spinal nurse and hospital consultant sat me down and told me I have a disability it actually took me a little time to see what they meant but the difference it made to my life was startling, I researched my health issues, joined forums and support groups and sort the help I needed and I can honestly say that out of all of it the motability scheme has been the greatest of all, freedom to go where I need to when I want to and to also return when I have to, the ability to help with daily activities like doing my own shopping etc… I could go on…. If you looked at me you would have no idea of the daily struggle I go through but trust me it’s there and I am aware that it will never improve and that is why I think the change of view towards long term mental health issues is a welcome change for all those out there that suffer and don’t have an immediately obvious disability……January 30, 2018 at 12:58 pm #39842
Oscarmax, I appreciate the prompt retraction of your initial personal comment in reaction to “Gasmanoo’s” post.
I would hope that Gasmanoo has had the time to think about his ill informed post, and will realise that Motability has a responsibility to both physically and mentally impaired individuals.
As has already been pointed out, many recipients of higher level PIP do not drive as they are unable to do so. This is why Motability allow nominated drivers.
This is an open forum so we have to expect a wide spectrum of thought and opinions. This can and should be beneficial to furthering debate, as long as we remain civil.
WMC Forum was set up to be the home of friendly and respectful debate.
Please let’s keep it this way …. Thank you.January 30, 2018 at 1:07 pm #39844
This is a good move, however with benefits and such, The government always gives with one hand and takes away with the other. So expect a rapid review of the pip points criteria, making it even harder to qualify. Also with mental health issues a blue badge is not always issued. As councils cherry pick the points system.January 30, 2018 at 2:25 pm #39851
Hi Jane, just a word of warning, my wife had a neurostimulator fitted for chronic migraine, it has been a disaster, she has had to give up work, with many additional problems . So if it is for your back, ask what percentage it has actually helped, be carefulJanuary 30, 2018 at 7:03 pm #39870
January 30, 2018 at 7:54 pm #39873
- Was it the reactive 8 Mac,?
- Been told about it read some reviews on it but could not find negatives on it.
Hi, really helpful post. My wife suffered at the hands of the DWP and their unqualified sub-contractors ATOS when she transferred from DLA to PIP. Quite late on we came across a website called , Benefits and Work, it costs a few pounds to join and is brilliant. We wish we had found it earlier , it would have saved a lot of stress. Anyway we ended up submitting a successful reconsideration with the info from this site.
Good luck everyone .
Regards, WonkyJanuary 31, 2018 at 12:48 am #39886
Glad to hear wonky, it’s so warming knowing everyone is contributing and willing to share their experiences, helping others and making this such a friendly forum.January 31, 2018 at 7:01 am #39890
When compiling my wife’s PIP claim, I used the Disability Rights Handbook (link below) which, although it isn’t an easy read, provides comprehensive information on ALL benefits that may be available to people with any and all types of disability and precisely how to deal with each and every question. It is published annually and is available at a discount to those with disabilities (sadly, they never seem to publish enough and always sell out). I know of several people who used supposed ‘professional advisers’ from Citizens Advice and a particular disability organisation for assistance with their PIP applications and received poor advice, resulting in their claim being unsuccessful. If the nature of your disability means that working through a book like this may be problematic, it would be well worth seeing if a relative or friend would be willing to assist.January 31, 2018 at 9:39 am #39901
Hi Jane , I have not heard of that device, so what my wife had fitted and ( taken back out ) is probably different,
macFebruary 5, 2018 at 11:52 am #40183
Well after 25+ years of DLA I’m having the PIP assessment at home in a couple of weeks, don’t know what to expect other then its Capita and a friend had them around last year and she said the lady was nice and just entered some details on a laptop, basically the same questions as on the original application form.
It will be very clear to them when they see me that I am what I am with the conditions I’ve stated but it still makes me nervous about seeing a stranger and knowing that I was awarded the benefit and now having them say its being stopped but you can apply for another benefit, if I’m eligible I’m eligible.February 5, 2018 at 1:18 pm #40186
Goldmember, if you don’t subscribe to Benefits and Work, then do it now. Believe me it’ll be the best £20 you ever spent. Their online guides and forums are fantastic. You can ask them any question regarding your PIP assessment and you’ll get honest, straight and helpful answers.
As Wonky says, they are brilliant, and I can speak from very recent experience, I would have not got PIP, had it not been for the guides and online chat.