Ownership of a Battery Electric Vehicle

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    Topic
  • #222902
    MFillingham
    Participant

      It was suggested that I started a guide from those of us who own one of the many Battery Electric Vehicles (BEVs) on the scheme for those who were either considering for their next car or were looking into the future feeling the inevitability of the switch looming in the distance.

       

      For those who own a BEV, please feel free to add your experience but bear in mind this is intended to help, not preach.

      I fear this might be a long post, so I’ll probably break it down into several posts just to ease the reading.

      Ownership can be broken into 4 areas (which might expand over time) Terminology, Driving, Charging at home and Charging away from home.  I am not in a position to go into depth about the environmental impact of any vehicle, let alone the new technology, so I’m going to gracefully bow out of that area.

      Terminology.  There’s a lot of changes to keep in mind.  Starting with the various types of Electric Vehicles.

      There’s the Mild Hybrid and Full Hybrid – both running on petrol/diesel most of the time and adding power from a small battery through a motor either to add power or to provide a short range of running without burning fuel.

      Plug in Hybrid (PHEV) this is a half way solution between ICE (Internal Combustion Engine) and full BEV.  The battery is big enough to typically give between 15 and 50 miles of pure electric driving.  Then, should that run out, there’s a ICE ready to take over and keep driving.  This means that long trips don’t come with the thoughts about charging and taking breaks but local trips have all the benefits to the local air quality of electric driving.

      Regenerative Braking, Regen. When an ICE vehicle slows down, there’s physical resistance put through the braking system which slows the car.  This generates a certain amount of heat as wasted energy, it also requires a number of materials that will need replacing over time.  Whilst an EV will still have these,  there is a system in place that can slow a car using the same motor that drives it forward.  It uses that motor to run in reverse – using physical motion to create electrical energy.  This puts a little back into the battery and reduces the speed of the car without physical braking.  Some cars have one level and it’s either on or off, others have several different levels between a slight slowing over time to a rather aggressive and dramatic stop.

      One Pedal Driving – a continuation of Regenerative Braking is the ability to use only the accelerator.  Much like a go cart you press the pedal to go forward and release it to slow down.  This can be at a rate where the car will come to a complete stop in a reasonable distance or can reduce to a near stop in a controlled but still useful manner.  When driving around town this becomes a very useful manner of driving, especially for those of us with lower limb struggles who may find twisting the foot between the accelerator and brake to be a struggle at times.  Easing this movement down to either a point where you need to come to a complete stop or even just to hold the car once stopped is much better for the driver that the constant stop/go of heavy traffic.

      Measurements of power – the Kilowatt Hour (kWh) is the measure of storage, it’s how much the battery holds and is the release of 1 kilowatt over for an hour.  The Kilowatt, is a measure of power and is usually the power provided by the motor.  Even dealers get these mixed up, so don’t feel bad if you don’t get it.  Storage is simple, the more you have the further you can go (bearing in mind that more batteries equals more weight).

      If anyone has more they’d like to add, please feel free.

      My next post will be driving.

      I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
      I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

      Mark

    Viewing 25 replies - 76 through 100 (of 104 total)
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    • #230043
      MFillingham
      Participant

        Thanks Daf, it means a lot when strangers are so supportive

        I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
        I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

        Mark

        #232196
        kezo
        Participant

          Quick check in to say – Hope you are feeling a little better and on the mend mate 🙂

          #232507
          MFillingham
          Participant

            Thanks mate.  Am mending slowly I am still spending most of my time in bed as it’s the base of my spine causing most pain.

            Hopefully I’ll be able to sit at the computer for a while soon and will be back posting here more regularly.

            I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
            I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

            Mark

            #232529
            kezo
            Participant

              Good to hear your slowy on the mend buddy 🙂

               

              #232604
              Bowly101
              Participant

                @MFillingham

                Thank you so much for such a detailed, well thought out, well written, and comprehensive guide to the world of BEV’s. Of course, the other contributors have all added something valuable, but the initial posts are excellent. In part, along with the financial aspect of ev driving, your posts have convinced me that going electric is the correct choice for me. I read that you’re struggling with health and I wish you fortitude to endure, but know this. Your posts have given me, in part at least, the joy of researching, evaluating, and experiencing BEV’s which have resulted in me ordering one. Your enthusiasm and time is very much appreciated, thank you from a Welshman in Scotland!

                My contribution to this excellent thread? If my calculations are correct (and I’ve done them many times now!), the cost of fuelling my car will go from the approx £7000 petrol bill over the last 40k miles to around £1200 in increased electric bill costs. My £1000 home charger has been installed free of charge, my OVO account has been linked with my Ohme app, all really easy to do from your chair. And the driving experience? I’ve always been a petrol head, always in a hot hatch of ever increasing power until health dictated otherwise, and I think the electric driving experience is as good as I’ve ever had. That’ll vary car to car of course, but I’m very happy to recommend anyone to go and try out a Renault Megane E Tech. 220hp, instant power, comfy, well specced, easy to get in and out of. Simply lovely ?.

                 

                 

                #232605
                MFillingham
                Participant

                  @MFillingham Thank you so much for such a detailed, well thought out, well written, and comprehensive guide to the world of BEV’s. Of course, the other contributors have all added something valuable, but the initial posts are excellent. In part, along with the financial aspect of ev driving, your posts have convinced me that going electric is the correct choice for me. I read that you’re struggling with health and I wish you fortitude to endure, but know this. Your posts have given me, in part at least, the joy of researching, evaluating, and experiencing BEV’s which have resulted in me ordering one. Your enthusiasm and time is very much appreciated, thank you from a Welshman in Scotland! My contribution to this excellent thread? If my calculations are correct (and I’ve done them many times now!), the cost of fuelling my car will go from the approx £7000 petrol bill over the last 40k miles to around £1200 in increased electric bill costs. My £1000 home charger has been installed free of charge, my OVO account has been linked with my Ohme app, all really easy to do from your chair. And the driving experience? I’ve always been a petrol head, always in a hot hatch of ever increasing power until health dictated otherwise, and I think the electric driving experience is as good as I’ve ever had. That’ll vary car to car of course, but I’m very happy to recommend anyone to go and try out a Renault Megane E Tech. 220hp, instant power, comfy, well specced, easy to get in and out of. Simply lovely ?.

                   

                  Oh my!!!

                  Thank you for your feedback, even now, whilst feeling somewhat pained and unwell, this fills me with joy.

                  I hope you enjoy the Megane, I looked at it but it’s too small for us.  Do remember though, the range quoted won’t be the range you get, especially if you ’enjoy’ the car too much.  However, even if you add another £300 to your fuel bill it’s still a huge saving over Dino juice.

                  I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                  I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                  Mark

                  #232609
                  Bowly101
                  Participant

                    Hi Mark,

                    Glad to bring you some joy ?!

                    I based the figures on the Megane doing 200 miles per 60kw charge, Renault quote 280 wltp, and ev database say 235, but I’ve downgraded it a bit as we get very cold winters here, I don’t do much city driving, and that car is a hoot so I can imagine using the loud (well, quiet on an ev ?) pedal more than I should! I did the calculations many times as the figures didn’t compute at first. It’s been a while since O level maths, but sure enough, the reality is almost unbelievable. In fact, if I hadn’t of done them myself I wouldn’t have believed them. That’s the price to pay for being a Luddite and not considering ev’s sooner. I’m considering using the savings to partly fund replacing my aging house back up generator (3kw) with a solar/battery back up system. Like ev’s, seem expensive at first but the long term benefit is large and the peace of mind being able to power all my electrics during a power cut is huge. Again, never even considered it before. Thanks again ?.

                    #232677
                    MFillingham
                    Participant

                      Some credit must be given to @kezo for encouraging/daring me to put this together.

                      I’m glad someone has found it beneficial.

                      I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                      I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                      Mark

                      #233503
                      MFillingham
                      Participant

                        @kezo  Some good news, I’m up and about.  I’m still getting IV antibiotics daily but I’m able to get around and spend some time here, keeping an eye on the anti-EV posts 😉  I’m feeling much better but still getting some pain in my back.  There’s still a way to go but this is a huge step and gets me feeling much more useful at home.

                        I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                        I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                        Mark

                        #233518
                        kezo
                        Participant

                          @kezo Some good news, I’m up and about. I’m still getting IV antibiotics daily but I’m able to get around and spend some time here, keeping an eye on the anti-EV posts ? I’m feeling much better but still getting some pain in my back. There’s still a way to go but this is a huge step and gets me feeling much more useful at home.

                          Good to hear! Take it easy and wish you a full recovery soon 🙂

                          In your absence I have assisted with chargers from an install prospective, helped @Phaedra on his EV journey. Will leave him to tell you all about it 🙂

                          I even went to test drive the Audi q4 Etron, which as you know I prefer the interior over the rest of the VW group. I even test drove the Ariya as my local dealer was giving £2500 AP contribution. I had every intention of taking a chance on the Audi and hopefully perking you up by putting the order for on your topic. Several members thought I was converted but sadly not, I bucked at the last minute, due to the longer journey’s with a non motorway journeys! In the end I’m likely to go halfway and order the Mazda CX60 PHEV 🙂

                           

                          #233521
                          MFillingham
                          Participant

                            Test driving one of the current range of EVs!!??  That’s a huge step for you, it wasn’t that long ago that none offered you the range you required so you weren’t even going to look.  I’ll take a PHEV, even if it’s a Mazda (personal choice, I know but they’ve always felt ‘old and slow’ to me but I’ve not been in one for a few years) the ability to plug in and drive a reasonable amount of local miles is always better than chugging an engine through the neighbourhood.

                             

                            I’ve seen how you help with charger installs, anyone who gets your advice will do well to take heed.  Good to see you helping others with EV choices.  Hopefully with threads like this and with people willing to give their good experiences plus a few ‘experts’ to help with the more complex queries, the future looks sorted here 🙂

                             

                            I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                            I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                            Mark

                            #233523
                            kezo
                            Participant

                              @kezo Some good news, I’m up and about. I’m still getting IV antibiotics daily but I’m able to get around and spend some time here, keeping an eye on the anti-EV posts ? I’m feeling much better but still getting some pain in my back. There’s still a way to go but this is a huge step and gets me feeling much more useful at home.

                              Good to hear! Take it easy and wish you a full recovery soon ? In your absence I have assisted with chargers from an install prospective, helped @Phaedra on his EV journey. Will leave him to tell you all about it ? I even went to test drive the Audi q4 Etron, which as you know I prefer the interior over the rest of the VW group. I even test drove the Ariya as my local dealer was giving £2500 AP contribution. I had every intention of taking a chance on the Audi and hopefully perking you up by putting the order for on your topic. Several members thought I was converted but sadly not, I bucked at the last minute, due to the longer journey’s with a non motorway journeys! In the end I’m likely to go halfway and order the Mazda CX60 PHEV ?

                              Lack and speed of chargers on A & B roads and relying on slower chargers from MFG forcourts put me off. Of caurse I could of diverted 60-70 and used the motorwaydt that seemed pointless. Maybe next time eh 🙂

                              The CX60 has 327hp 500Nm of torque with 5.2s or 5.8s 0-62 depending on mode and an acclaimed 40 miles EV. I’ll probably go with the darker interior 🙂

                              #233548
                              Avatar photoWindy
                              Participant

                                @Bowly101

                                So pleased that you have made excellent use of a calculator or pencil to see what you are going to save, but I thought I would mention something often forgotten, when you are on an EV tariff it’s a great time to put your washing drying even par roasting a dinner onto timers thus making even further use of the cheap rate and bringing your driving costs down a little more. We have just changed car and reduced costs back to 1.7p per mile without counting the extra household gadget savings.

                                Good luck with your EV enjoy it

                                I am the carer / driver for my wife who cannot drive due to disability

                                #233550
                                Bowly101
                                Participant

                                  @Windy

                                  Thanks for that, your point is well made and could provide some extra incentive to switch to electric motoring.

                                  In my particular case I already have OVO energy and they do a bolt on tariff called ‘Anytime’ which charges 9.52p per kWh but only when charging a vehicle. To take advantage of this tariff you must have a smart meter (which we already had) and link the tariff to the Ohme app. OVO then charge the standard rate for every unit used, irrespective of whether it’s the car charger or not, but credit you back the amount it thinks you’ve used to charge the car at the end of the month. I’m not sure how it knows which electrical devices are consuming energy at any given time, but I’m guessing that a combo of being linked to the app and the size of the power draw will indicate to their system that a vehicle is being charged. This will mean that the excellent benefit you’ve outlined in your post won’t apply to me, but certainly will to others on a more conventional tariff. I know that Octopus Go works as you’ve suggested, in that there’s a time period (normally through the night) where all electricity consumed is at a lower rate, and I’m sure there are plenty of others. In my case, as we already had OVO, it was easy just to stick with it and see how it went. We aren’t under contract as our fixed deal ended at the worst possible time during the energy cost crisis and there were no other deals better priced, but you can be sure that I’ll be monitoring how much I get credited back per month vs how much I’ve charged the car, the cynic in me thinks they’ve set it up like that to cheat a bit. It’s a strange charging system, you tell the system what time you need the car to be charged by then plug it in. It then intermittently charges based on when the carbon figure is least impacted, up to your chosen percentage and by the time specified. So, even though it’s branded as Anytime, to make it immediately charge at the maximum possible wattage you need to override this intermittent feature and force the system to provide all the power straight away which then charges you at normal rate (just under 30p per kWh). I’ll be seeing how it goes with the costings and adjusting suppliers if it doesn’t work out.

                                  Your excellent tip will be valuable to most I think, and all of these little gems of advice go towards education in the benefits of electric driving. So much of the mainstream press denigrates electric driving, they like to prey on fear of the unknown, it’s always good to hear the positives as well. ?

                                  #233555
                                  Avatar photoWindy
                                  Participant

                                    @Bowly101

                                    since having an EV we have been with Octopus but only on their go faster (5hours) and then reduced to 4 with Go but a full charge required 8.5 hours this is because we had a Stellantis vehicle they don’t link with. So we wanted a vehicle that could be linked with their Intelligent tariff this gives 6 hour of low price 7.5p from 11.30 to 5.30 but like yours they take over when you plug in and create a charge plan which maybe within or outside of these hours but you will still  only pay the low rate unless you override to immediate charge. The benefit then is that you still always get the 6 low hours as well regardless of their charge plan. This also works well as the new car only takes 5 1/2 hours for full charge this is where often people fail to realise big battery and long range cost more hours so many have a battery that can only be half charged cheaply at home.

                                    I am the carer / driver for my wife who cannot drive due to disability

                                    #233585
                                    Rene
                                    Participant

                                      @Bowly101 since having an EV we have been with Octopus but only on their go faster (5hours) and then reduced to 4 with Go but a full charge required 8.5 hours this is because we had a Stellantis vehicle they don’t link with. So we wanted a vehicle that could be linked with their Intelligent tariff this gives 6 hour of low price 7.5p from 11.30 to 5.30 but like yours they take over when you plug in and create a charge plan which maybe within or outside of these hours but you will still only pay the low rate unless you override to immediate charge. The benefit then is that you still always get the 6 low hours as well regardless of their charge plan. This also works well as the new car only takes 5 1/2 hours for full charge this is where often people fail to realise big battery and long range cost more hours so many have a battery that can only be half charged cheaply at home.

                                       

                                      That’s what we’re with, Octopus Intelligent. So far, so good – at first it was a little odd to not immediately charge the car but wait for them to decide when it’s charging, but so far (6+ months) there wasn’t a single time where the car wasn’t charged by the time we set it to (8am).

                                      Of course the bonus is that if they decide to charge in the middle of the day, the entire house goes to cheap electricity.

                                      I will say though, it’s not quite correct that you can’t charge big battery rigs “cheaply” at home, you very much can unless you’re driving 200 miles every single day. You can’t charge them fully in one go, but you can certainly space it over two days. I’m not quite certain how Octo Intelligent works with high capacity packs that aren’t ready within the 6 hours, i think you do get “extra” charge depending on availability. Highest we had was 9 hours of cheap electricity within a 24 hour timeframe.

                                      In regards to money..

                                      We picked our car up on the 10th of february this year, with barely any petrol in it of course. We refueled for £51 (Super/E5, not normal). We since then drove 3300 miles in total, the total petrol cost was £110, and electricity around £70 (there’s one month in there without EV tariff, makes it hard to judge accurately). Less than £200 for 3300 miles for certain though. The current “since refuel” numbers are the following.

                                      In our “old” car, a 2019 1.5 TSI SEAT Ateca, we spent slightly over £700 in the same timeframe.

                                      Now, of course, we are basically the perfect use-case for PHEVs – we can do many of our journeys within the around 34 miles of (real) range we get. The few that we can’t, are still “reasonably” economical – we drove a 150 mile roundtrip to Bristol to pick up parents in law, got 82mpg on that trip. Which i thought was pretty great considering we were driving the vast majority of that trip at absolutely not 80mph on the motorway.

                                      I’m still a little wary of full EVs, though i do think we’ll do the leap on the next car – but for certain, in a similar situation as we are in, a PHEV is just by far the best option. Potentially even better than a BEV if you can’t get a good deal and have to charge on stupendously expensive fastchargers on a longer journey.

                                      PS: our numbers could’ve been much better too – we potentially could’ve made it with just that one refuel from pickup over the 3300 miles – it’s just that if you have a reasonably powerful car, you tend to.. you know, you tend to be a little liberal with the right foot.

                                      edit: forgot to mention, the tank currently sits at 35% and 130 miles left, after 1250ish miles.

                                      Prior: SEAT Ateca Xcellence Lux 1.5 TSI DSG MY19
                                      Current: VW Golf GTE PHEV DSG MY23

                                      #237496
                                      kezo
                                      Participant

                                        Hi mate, could your check your mapping please for BP Pulse or MFG group stations that have 100kW or higher chargers along the A49 Shrewsbury to Leominster 🙂

                                        #237506
                                        MFillingham
                                        Participant

                                          Hi mate, could your check your mapping please for BP Pulse or MFG group stations that have 100kW or higher chargers along the A49 Shrewsbury to Leominster ?

                                           

                                          There’s nothing fitting that criteria.  There are a few chargers just off the A49 but they’re different suppliers.

                                          I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                                          I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                                          Mark

                                          #237771
                                          kezo
                                          Participant

                                            There’s nothing fitting that criteria.  There are a few chargers just off the A49 but they’re different suppliers.

                                            Thanks mate, do you mind having a look at the others along with those with higher charging rates 🙂

                                            #237779
                                            MFillingham
                                            Participant

                                              @kez, Ok ->

                                               

                                              2 Osprey Chargers at Travelodge Ludlow 79ppkWh

                                              1 Fuuse 150kW Tuffins Supermarket and Garden Centre 59ppkWh

                                              3 Type 2 also at Tuffins 59ppkWh

                                              2 Instavolt at OK Diners Leominster 85ppkWh

                                              Pogo Charge @ Leominster Fire Station 79ppkWh

                                               

                                              Just going on the information from ZapMap.  I can’t guarantee the Fuuse prices are correct.

                                              I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                                              I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                                              Mark

                                              #237782
                                              kezo
                                              Participant

                                                @kez, Ok -> 2 Osprey Chargers at Travelodge Ludlow 79ppkWh 1 Fuuse 150kW Tuffins Supermarket and Garden Centre 59ppkWh 3 Type 2 also at Tuffins 59ppkWh 2 Instavolt at OK Diners Leominster 85ppkWh Pogo Charge @ Leominster Fire Station 79ppkWh Just going on the information from ZapMap. I can’t guarantee the Fuuse prices are correct.

                                                apart the the Fuuse 150kW  and possibly the 2 instavolt at OK diners the rest would be 7kW at a guess.

                                                The prices aren’t so much an issue but, I hate stopping and if having to do so I don’t want to hang around hence why I asked for high speed ones.

                                                Thank you for looking 🙂

                                                #237790
                                                MFillingham
                                                Participant

                                                  The only 7kW ones are the Type 2s, everything else is at least 150kWh.

                                                  I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                                                  I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                                                  Mark

                                                  #237796
                                                  kezo
                                                  Participant

                                                    Thanks Mark.

                                                    In all honesty I’m confused, not with the infrastructure or anything like that but with the range I’ll get especially in winter months. On EV datebase it says from 170 -355 for the ioniq 5. 170 miles won’t get me there and what I don’t want is to charge both ways, especially if I need to get there in an emergency which your aware of.

                                                    My driving is on the faster side especially on roads above 40mph when allowing, adding 20% would be the ballpark speed. Most the roads are single carriageway with a small dualcarriage way at Brecon (70) and the A5 (70) where I join a fast flowing single carriage way (a49) that takes me up towards whitchurch.

                                                    I suffer badly with Raynauds, s if I went the EV route, wandering about an heatpump.

                                                    Confused.com lol

                                                    #237802
                                                    MFillingham
                                                    Participant

                                                      Thanks Mark. In all honesty I’m confused, not with the infrastructure or anything like that but with the range I’ll get especially in winter months. On EV datebase it says from 170 -355 for the ioniq 5. 170 miles won’t get me there and what I don’t want is to charge both ways, especially if I need to get there in an emergency which your aware of. My driving is on the faster side especially on roads above 40mph when allowing, adding 20% would be the ballpark speed. Most the roads are single carriageway with a small dualcarriage way at Brecon (70) and the A5 (70) where I join a fast flowing single carriage way (a49) that takes me up towards whitchurch. I suffer badly with Raynauds, s if I went the EV route, wandering about an heatpump. Confused.com lol

                                                       

                                                      Ok, so here’s what I understand about the EV Database figures.  The Highway – Cold is running at -10 with heating on (really??!) given unless you’re driving around Scotland, -10 is unlikely, you’ll get better than that.  There’s also a great difference in range between 70mph and 65mph.  In reality, there’s not a great deal of difference in journey time between the two – 2 hours 51 for 200 miles at 70 and 3 hours 4 minutes at 65. Assuming, of course, that you are at a steady and constant speed.

                                                      Heatpumps are a tricky question, there are people who must have them, others who swear they make no difference in the British climate.  I tend to find the two groups also fall into those with and without heatpumps respectively 😉  Would I spend a grand or so on one, no but I live in mild Cornwall where everyone else is knee deep in snow before we see much more than a flake.  Would I recommend someone else have one?  No, not because they’re not good value or won’t save you a few miles but because I won’t pay for one, so it’d be wrong of me to suggest someone else should. Some basic maths (if you can get the data) would tell you if it’s financially viable (extra range given x price per mile all over cost of heatpump = miles required to break even).  However, your need is around time and stopping and I’ve absolutely no idea what will happen.

                                                       

                                                      Have a look at this:  https://www.speakev.com/threads/non-heat-pump-car-vs-heat-pump-power-usage-comparison.165506/  It’s and EV6 but will explain in technical detail how having heating on effected his journey.

                                                      I'm Autistic, if I say something you find offensive, please let me know, I can guarantee it was unintentional.
                                                      I'll try to give my honest opinion but am always open to learning.

                                                      Mark

                                                      #237977
                                                      kezo
                                                      Participant

                                                        Thanks Mark I’ll ave a look over the weekend 🙂

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