EV/PHEV solar roof panels

This topic contains 25 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  Brydo 1 year, 3 months ago.

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  • #72758 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Until recently the efficiency of solar panels have not been good enough to make fitting them to a vehicle worth while. I am not sure of the solar panel efficiency on this car but recently solar panel efficiency has risen to 29%, once you get to this level cars of this type become really interesting. To be able to generate 30km per day just from the solar panels is excellent.

    Based on what i have read the efficiency of solar panels will increase to over 30% very soon and once that is achieved, and even at the efficiency`s available just now, solar panels on your roof together with a BEV is a no brainer.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72760 Reply

    vinalspin
    Participant

    The most efficient solar panel in the world is able to convert sunlight into electricity at an efficiency of 44.5%, now accepting some transfer loss from collection to feed if they really put some muscle(money from one or two of the big car players) behind more R & D and actually started fitting them as an option or even standard these levels would start to rise sharply, if used in conjunction with say a hydrogen fuel cell then we’d be on a winner.

    #72762 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    The panels you refer to are used by NASA but cost about £40000 per panel so not really cost effective for this particular purpose.

    IMO solar panels, in the near future, will be one of the main power sources on the planet. When you actually look at how much sunlight falls on the earth each day it is absolutely incredible the energy we could convert.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72768 Reply

    mitch
    Participant

    a simple thing would be if the govt forced all new build homes to have solar panels, i dont get why they dont quite honestly.

    #72770 Reply

    Ian

    I have a 6.7 KW solar array on my roof house roof. I had to ask permission because the normal size is 4kw. I think we are a long way off solar powering cars although clearly it could help. I’m hoping that battery technology in EVs develops significantly to improve purchase costs because I currently produce find I make more electricity than I need at certain times of the day but then still need to purchase when I am unable to produce.

    #72771 Reply

    Oscarmax
    Participant

    a simple thing would be if the govt forced all new build homes to have solar panels, i dont get why they dont quite honestly.

    I agree, in 2009 we built a new house in Wales, we had to fit solar water heating panels as part of the planning permission.

    We recently brought a brand new 2 bedroom bungalow in England we are surprised the developers did not fit solar panel to the roof, all 5 bungalows have a perfect south facing roofs?


    In 2005 I suffered a brain injury which has left me with mental and physical disabilities.
    Unfortunately I do get confused and get things wrong, so I apologise in advance.

    #72786 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Guys I agree solar panels should be fitted to all new build with south, south east and south west facing roofs. I am in the west of Scotland, so hardly the sunniest part of the country, and my 4kw system generates between 3000 and 3200 kWh per year. If I had the new 29% efficient panels I would generate 9000kwh that would run my house and my BEV, if I had one, for most of the year.

    The efficiency of these panels means that seven panels would give a 4 kWh system rather than the sixteen required now.

    I think the government should pay people to put solar on appropriate roofs. The owners should pay upfront and then the government pay them a percentage each year until the cost has been paid back.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72800 Reply

    vinalspin
    Participant

    I wasn’t suggesting using the NASA panels :0 I was just pointing to the technology being out there and if pursued by the right people that it would move on in leaps and bounds(although I wouldn’t put it past BMW to offer as an extra at £40K).

    #72801 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Yes the technology is there vinyspin and every year the efficiency of, even affordable panels, is increasing. I have mine for seven years and they have been great but installing them now, with no feed in tariff available, makes little economic sense unless you have a BEV.

    With a BEV the panels, depending on the size of your array, would pay for themselves in about six years…..ish.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72802 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Ian battery technology is progressing fast and battery costs are falling dramatically. They reckon as a result of this BEVs will be cheaper to produce than ICE cars in three years time. With size of array you have, assuming they are facing south…..ish, you must be producing a lot more electricity than you use.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72808 Reply

    Oscarmax
    Participant

    Solar panel grants and feed in tariffs end on the 31 March, correct me if I am wrong if you have a smart electric meted you loose you feed in tariff regardless?.

    At present a 4 kWh  latest LG fitted just under £5000, I am hoping the market will respond and offer 4/5 kWh systems with a battery storage system around similar prices?


    In 2005 I suffered a brain injury which has left me with mental and physical disabilities.
    Unfortunately I do get confused and get things wrong, so I apologise in advance.

    #72810 Reply

    Ian

    Thank you for that yes producing lots of electricity on my South Facing Roof overlooking Morecambe Bay. Last year I produced 7.3 Megawatts but still managed to pay for 3.3 Megawatts from the grid.

    That said batteries continue to be too expensive at nearly £5K (which buys an awful lot of electricity). I’m hoping what you are saying is right and batteries will reduce further and help me to be able to use more of the electricity I generate.

    Interestingly on gloomy days, there still will need for me to buy from the grid because I will be unable to produce/store enough.

    #72818 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Ian once you get a BEV (battery electric vehicle) with a V2G (vehicle to grid) charger you won’t need a separate battery. You would set your charger to send spare electricity to your car battery during the day, then, when the sun goes down, use the electricity in the car battery to run your house.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72819 Reply

    Ian

    Thanks I am really interested in this. Do you have any links I could research and also any vehicle recommendations?

    #72820 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    I’m out just now but will post some stuff later with regard to V2G. With regard to BEVs I would recommend the Kia e Nero, it will give you about 250 miles on a single charge. It is a small SUV type of car and the reviews are good. Unfortunately there is nothing on the scheme I could recommend in full BEV.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72823 Reply

    Ian

    Thank you muchly I’m off out also but really interested in cars that do this stuff…..Nero=long lead times at the mo?

    #72830 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Unfortunately EV’s are flying off the production line but demand is outstripping supply. As far as I know there is a years waiting time for the e Nero, which, IMO, is the reason motability don’t have many on the scheme. I foresee we will be on the periphery of the EV revolution getting offered EV’s no one really wants.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72843 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Vehicle to Grid: Your electric car as a power station.

    The electric vehicle revolution will do more than reduce carbon emissions. Vehicle-to-grid technology (V2G), can give you ultimate control over your energy, and even make you money. Fancy getting your own mini power station? Then read on.

    What’s ‘vehicle to grid’ technology?
    ‘Vehicle to grid’ technology, also referred to as ‘V2G’ enables energy stored in electric vehicles to be fed back into the national electricity network (or ‘grid’) to help supply energy at times of peak demand. It’s just one technological advancement in a slew of new initiatives like ‘smart charging’ and ‘demand side response’ that are aimed at changing the way individuals, and businesses, use energy in the future. In short: the electric car revolution is tied into a whole new way of consuming energy1.

    https://www.ovoenergy.com/guides/electric-cars/vehicle-to-grid-technology.html

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72875 Reply

    Ian

    Thanks for this, I think this identifies that the grid can be supported by capacity in ev batteries running houses mustn’t be far away must it?

    #72877 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    It is the future of the grid Ian. At present electricity suppliers are paid to turn OFF their supply when there is over capacity. Yes they are payed billions to turn off their supply. This won’t happen when we have lots of EVs plugged in overnight. They will take all of this, otherwise wasted, electricity then during peak times, when the grid needs it, the electricity in the batteries would be taken to supply the needs of the grid.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72885 Reply

    vinalspin
    Participant

    There is also the photovoltaic covered glass that they’re installing in high rise buildings that could be incorporated as well.

    #72887 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    There are many new options coming to the market over the next few years. Perovskite is an abundant and cheap mineral that is changing the way the Sun’s energy can be harnessed. They are talking about coatings that can be sprayed onto most surfaces and can generate electricity. What about the entire surface of your car, house or office block working as one large solar panel.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72905 Reply

    vinalspin
    Participant

    If they did the top  of my head I could charge my phone while I scoot into town 😉

    #72943 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    Article

    Renault vehicle-to-grid charging pilot scheme announced

    Renault Group announces trial of vehicle-to-grid technology across Europe

    Last Updated: 21 Mar 2019 tweet
    share

    Renault is researching the feasibility of large-scale vehicle-to-grid (V2G) charging, with a pilot scheme beginning in Portugal and the Netherlands today.

    V2G charging lets drivers sell their cars’ battery power back to the grid at times of high electricity demand, with charging speeds increasing or decreasing automatically depending on supply.

    One of Renault’s main objectives is to assess an “onboard reversible charger” solution, which would allow V2G charging to take place with only low-cost adaptations needed to existing charging terminals.

    It also hopes to measure the large-scale feasibility of the technology, and demonstrate its value to local and national grid operators.

    V2G charging could encourage the uptake of wind and solar power, as it would increase the total energy storage capacity available to suppliers.
    Advertisement

    “With this initiative, Groupe Renault is fully fulfilling its role as a leader in electric mobility for all and as a player in the energy transition,” said Renault’s director of electric vehicles Gilles Normand.

    “Vehicle-to-grid charging is a key pillar of the smart electric ecosystems that Groupe Renault has set up. We have chosen onboard technology that also optimizes the cost of recharging stations and thus facilitate a large-scale development.”

    Renault will introduce a fleet of 15 specially adapted ZOE superminis in 2019, with the pilot scheme starting in Utrecht in the Netherlands and on Porto Santo Island in Portugal today.

    Further schemes are planned for France, Germany, Switzerland, Sweden and Denmark at a later date.

    The French automotive firm hopes the trial will allow it to establish the common standards required for mass roll-out of the technology, and lay the groundwork for its future offerings in the V2G field.

    Earlier this year, National Grid’s head of innovation Stephen Marland told DrivingElectric that vehicle-to-grid charging was a “really exciting” avenue that could play a big part in the UK’s future infrastructure.

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

    #72944 Reply

    Brydo
    Participant

    24M’s Dual Electrolyte System To Enable 350 Wh/kg Batteries

    2 H BY MARK KANE 12

    Anolytes and catholytes opens the way for 350 Wh/kg
    24M announced the upcoming presentation of a novel Dual Electrolyte System for higher energy batteries, at the International Battery Seminar & Exhibit in Fort Lauderdale, Fla. later this month (on Thursday, March 28).

    The new concept utilizes two compositionally distinct electrolytes – anolytes and catholytes – for two electrodes, “expanding the universe of potential electrolytes, including water and other materials that to-date have not been compatible with both the anode and cathode simultaneously”. According to 24M, having two electrolytes enables it to use next-generation chemistries to increase energy density to 350 Wh/kg and improve cycle life, safety and cost.

    The news sounds great and we are happy to see that there is potential to significantly increase energy density, while at the same time keep costs under control.

    “The 24M SemiSolid electrode platform provides the foundation for its Dual Electrolyte System, dramatically improving overall manufacturing capital efficiency, while allowing distinct approaches to cell design and chemistry. The novel 24M cell architecture uses an ionically conductive, non-permeable separator to isolate the anolyte from the catholyte, while eliminating solid-to-solid interface issues that have plagued full solid-state approaches to date. 24M’s work with numerous world-class materials manufacturers has shown this approach will be both manufacturable and cost-effective.”

    “The architecture of the 24M cell and manufacturing process for SemiSolid electrodes have been proven via many tens-of-thousands of cells over the past eight years of development. This work has laid the foundation for the development of the Dual Electrolyte System, the initial testing of which will be discussed at the seminar.”
    Rick Feldt, President and CEO of 24M said:

    “Using compositionally distinct electrolytes is a game changer for battery manufacturing and we’ve proven the fundamental technology. At the conference, Naoki will discuss how the 24M Dual Electrolyte System expands the universe of potential electrolytes, including water and other materials that to-date have not been compatible with both the anode and cathode simultaneously.”
    Koji Hasegawa, General Manager, Industrial Chemicals Department, Itochu Corporation said:

    “The unique 24M approach to compositionally distinct electrolytes makes it possible for 24M to embark on radical new directions in anode and cathode chemistry. Seldom in lithium-ion battery development has such a possibility been realizable, but the advancement in solid-state ion conductors and 24M’s SemiSolid electrodes opens this possibility.”

    The only person who got all his work done by Friday was Robinson Crusoe.
    Anything i post over three lines long please assume it is an article lol.

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